Tobias Rauscher:
So, you need to get your fans in your own system. You need to own your fans. This is, yeah, extremely important. And then, once the people or your fans are in your own system, you have all the power.

Michael Walker:
It's easy to get lost in today's music industry with constantly changing technology and where anyone with the computer can release music. I'm going to share with you why this is the best time to be an independent musician, and it's only getting better.

Michael Walker:
If you have high quality music, but you just don't know the best way to promote yourself, so that you can reach the right people and generate a sustainable income with your music, we're going to show you the best strategies that we're using right now to reach millions of new listeners every month without spending 10 hours a day on social media.

Michael Walker:
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Michael Walker:
Tobias, hey, what's up, man? How are you doing today?

Tobias Rauscher:
Oh, I'm doing fine. I'm here in Spain right now. How are you?

Michael Walker:
Doing well. Tobias, I feel like you're just like a world traveler. You're always somewhere new. So, how long have you been in Spain for, and what's your travel plans right now?

Tobias Rauscher:
Oh, basically, I'm just here for one week. So, not that long this time. And then, I don't know, but I think the last time when we had this session, I've been in Thailand.

Michael Walker:
Yep.

Tobias Rauscher:
Then, we met in Costa Rica, and now, we are here in... I'm in Spain, so it's pretty international. Yeah.

Michael Walker:
Cool. It's awesome. You're like living the nomad life, and it's so cool. And I think that it's really part of the movement that we're all a part of right now. The fact that we're here right now, and we're able to connect through this conference on the internet, online, remotely, and you as a musician, like you can get your music heard around the world by people without necessarily having to play a show in person, it's so awesome.

Michael Walker:
And news alert, YouTube is like one of the best platforms, surely, to be able to get your music heard by a worldwide audience without necessarily having to play in person, especially if there's like a global pandemic or something, that's preventing people from getting together in person. What a gift to be able to stay connected with people, and actually, build an audience and grow on a platform like YouTube.

Michael Walker:
Good that everyone in the room right now because Tobias is actually a YouTube expert. Let me actually pull up my official intro for you. Tobias is a modern percussive fingerstyle guitar player, and if you Google him or go to his YouTube and actually look at his YouTube videos of him playing his a fingerstyle percussive guitar, super impressive, really cool.

Michael Walker:
And these videos have millions and millions of views. And in Costa Rica, he was one of our guest presenters that we brought out for our platinum artist mastermind, and I got to see it in person too, jam it out, Rishi, he was one of our platinum artists. He was doing an Indian style vocal overlay to it. It's really cool.

Michael Walker:
But Tobias, he is someone who walks the walk of what he teaches. So he personally has gotten millions of views on YouTube and he's actually over 50 million views. It's a lot of views. And after working at the music industry at Warner Music, Tobias made it his mission to help fellow artists and musicians to be able to grow their audience online. He founded the Fanbase Academy, which is a high class coaching and mentoring program for modern musicians that enables aspiring artists to make it in today's time without needing to rely on record labels.

Michael Walker:
Yeah, he's awesome. And really today, I thought it would be great to, one, just touch base with him. Every time we have a conversation, I feel like, myself firstly, I always learn a lot. Like I wish that I had a notebook here that I could be absorbing and taking notes as we do this, but that's what we have the replays for.

Michael Walker:
But I think, today, it would be great to really zero in on what are some of the biggest movements that you see happening right now online in order to actually build an audience how does YouTube fit into that strategy? Is YouTube still a place that you'd recommend for a lot of artists, and why is that? How can they be successful on YouTube to build an audience? And, yeah, I think it's going to be a lot of fun. So, Tobias, thanks so much for taking the time to come on here again.

Tobias Rauscher:
Thanks for inviting me.

Michael Walker:
Absolutely. For maybe for anyone who hasn't met you before, this is the first time connecting with you, you could introduce yourself quickly and share your story of how you got started with the Fanbase Academy.

Tobias Rauscher:
Yeah, sure. Hi, everyone. I'm Tobias from Germany, as you can hear about my weird German accent. And, yeah, back then, I worked in the music industry. At some point, I wanted to focus on my own music and then I am really went deep into all the YouTube stuff, strategies and really made it, so to say, on YouTube. So, that was really insane, all organic growth back then. And at some point, yeah, I really managed to travel or play shows even in far away countries like China or Singapore or Taiwan. And that was really amazing.

Tobias Rauscher:
And then, I decided to, yeah, help other fellow musicians as well to make it online because I think there's so much untapped potential and we really living in a new paradigm shift. The opportunities we have at our fingertips are just unparalleled. It's just insane. And musicians that started like 20 years ago, they didn't even have these opportunities and chances.

Tobias Rauscher:
But the thing is of the mindset of many modern musicians is still 20 years back. People trying to get a record deal, or something like this, or try to connect with a middle man, which still can work, but there are so many new possibilities and you just have to leverage them, because it has never been easier to put your music out there and show your music to the right audience, because you can reach like millions of people around the world for pennies.

Tobias Rauscher:
And everyone is on social media, on all these different channels. So, just like insane how, let's say easy it is nowadays to really get your music out there, find die hard fans and even make a living from your music. So, yeah, we are actually pretty blessed because we are living in some of the greatest times for modern musicians that don't want to rely on record deal.

Michael Walker:
Hundred percent. Yeah. It seems like the old way with the record labels is mostly like a lottery ticket where, one, a few might get a record deal, and if you didn't, that was basically like your only way to really be successful. Where now, it's like with the internet and because of what we're about to talk about on our conversation, you can actually directly reach out, connect with your fans without relying on that middle man.

Michael Walker:
And the funny thing too is even if you're goal today is to get a record label deal, what do they look for in terms of the artists they're going to sign? They look for artists that have an audience, that are going to bring people out to the shows. So, either way, the number one thing you could do is to grow your audience and start to build your fan base. So, super excited to dive into that.

Michael Walker:
So, when it comes to doing that, so, I think a lot of artists here, they've invested a lot of time, a lot of energy, a lot of money into recording their music, and maybe they didn't really have much of a strategy or they didn't really know how do I actually get in front of the right people, and actually, target the right people that are going to connect with it, and how do I actually build an audience and actually have a fan base that aren't just my friends and fans and family.

Michael Walker:
So, how would you recommend, what are some of the biggest opportunities for them to get started, and how do they find those people who are actually going to just resonate with their music, just for their music and start growing their audience?

Tobias Rauscher:
Yeah. First of all, I want to say that I think one of the biggest mistakes a lot of musicians make is to have wrong focus, because they focus on just production, writing, new songs, recording them and all that. And usually, the music is great and all that, but then, when it comes to getting the music out there, promoting it, you get crickets chirping and nothing happening. So, that's why, yeah, Michael and I and other people, of course, trying to help you to get in the action modes and focus on marketing, and really, see your music business as a business. And this is so incredibly important.

Tobias Rauscher:
In general, I can say that there are two channels you should focus on. First, organic growth strategies, and on the other hand, paid channels. And I would start with organic channels as well first, because, of course, you don't have to invest. And I think YouTube is one of the definitely best options. Right now, while I'm speaking, there are people watching my videos on YouTube that are recorded and uploaded like 10 years ago. So, YouTube is such a powerhouse.

Tobias Rauscher:
For example, if you are on, I don't know, TikTok, Instagram or Facebook, usually, you have these spikes. So, you always have to post new content, and with YouTube, it's like you post once, and if the video is optimized in the right way and works well, it keeps getting new views every day, each and every day, and this is so powerful.

Tobias Rauscher:
So, my recommendation is definitely to focus on video. It's still, I think, a lot of people don't really leverage YouTube, but for me, out of my experience, it's one of the most important channels we have today. Because it gives you a huge advantage, and it's really growing your fan base on autopilot, because YouTube recommends your music to new people that are highly likely to watch your music.

Tobias Rauscher:
And this is, yeah, actually, one of the biggest benefits of all platforms out there. And as well the engagement is much higher. For example, I tested one of my videos hash and loop. I uploaded it on YouTube and on Facebook. On both channels, the video got over a million views. So, I have a lot of data. But on... I don't know I remember the exact numbers, but I think it was like the view retention rate, so the time how long people really watched my video was 7% on Facebook and 55% on YouTube.

Tobias Rauscher:
So, people are really engaged with your content on YouTube and in Facebook, it's more like scrolling through the newsfeed, okay, it's nice. Next video. Next pet video and whatsoever. So, in YouTube, you have a more dedicated and focused audiences that really engage with you and really go down the rabbit hole, listen to more of your music and become real fans, and you bond better with your fans because they're not just listening to your music, but they're also watching it. So, it's much better actually to, yeah, find new fans that way.

Michael Walker:
That totally makes sense. Yeah. Like when it comes to the type of engagement that, if you just think about the platforms like YouTube, when people go to YouTube, they go to watch videos, and a lot of times, just longer form content in general. Like when people are on Facebook or like TikTok, they're just scrolling through, they're swiping, it's not really a place to go deep. So, I think every channel has its place or its purpose, or its pros and cons, but I think you're totally right that YouTube.

Michael Walker:
And I know personally, for our band, Paradise Fears, we had about 24 million views on YouTube. And it was a huge platform for us, and it was also, in terms of positioning, credibility, people took us more seriously when they saw that we had built an audience on YouTube and there is like a benefit to building a platform.

Michael Walker:
When it comes to YouTube, I would love to hear your take on pros and cons versus... So, we had a presenter come on yesterday, and it was a great conversation about TikTok. And obviously, TikTok is a huge trend right now, and there's quite a few artists who are breaking on TikTok. In terms of music discovery, it seems like that's a cool opportunity.

Michael Walker:
But I would love to hear your take on TikTok and YouTube and maybe how someone can use those in like a complementary way, or what your recommendation would be in terms of just how to think about their overall strategy as it relates to both YouTube and TikTok, but maybe just in like social media in general, just because, obviously, there's a whole landscape of social media platforms.

Tobias Rauscher:
Absolutely. And you should definitely focus on the channels that work for your audience. So, one of our mistake is a lot of artists spread their focus too broad, they try to be on Instagram, on YouTube, on TikTok, and on all these channels, but on all channels, they just put in 10% of what they could do, especially when you're not signed. When you don't have a big team behind, I recommend to put all your focus in one platform and really make that work.

Tobias Rauscher:
That's better than focusing on all platforms, or maybe just one or maybe two. And then, always, depends on your demographic and what you do, if you're able, for example, to create fancy videos that catch attention, maybe you have some, I don't know, cool percussive skills or some nice vocal skills, or beatboxing boxing skills, then, TikTok can work definitely really great. But if you make, example, I don't want to say boring music, but music that doesn't catch the attention right away, then, YouTube might be much better. Because you find people over there who are more interested in, for example, soothing, relaxing music or whatsoever.

Tobias Rauscher:
So, you really need to know your audience, and this is why it's so important to do some audience research, to really know who your audience actually is, yeah, or what kind of people are listening to your music. And then, you need to know where do they hang online? Is it more TikTok, is it YouTube? Is it Facebook? So, that's, as well an really important thing. And then, you can, yeah, really use these other channel to reach your perfect audience, so to say.

Tobias Rauscher:
But yeah, I'm a big fan of having a focus because you reach more, instead of trying to be everywhere.

Michael Walker:
Yep. That's super smart. So, it sounds like what you're saying is that there's so many different social media platforms, and it seems like there's always a new one coming out, like every year. It sounds like the dois social platform. I don't think that's actually a social platform, but dois, I think, is hilarious.

Michael Walker:
But your recommendation is to start with one and focus, and make it, like when you choose it, make sure that you're choosing the one that is where your audience, your ideal fans are most likely to actually hang out.

Michael Walker:
The next question that would lead me to would be, how does someone do that research, and how does someone know which platform is right for me based on my music or based on my demographic?

Tobias Rauscher:
Yeah. You find actually, if you Google that, for example, you find audience data, for example, from YouTube or TikTok and Instagram or Facebook. Yeah. And then, you can see, for example, on Facebook, there are more older people than, for example, on TikTok and Instagram. So, that, of course, plays a huge role, and then, again, you need to know your audience.

Tobias Rauscher:
So, you need to connect with your audience, and you need to know who your fans are. Maybe check out their profiles and really go deep. Ideally, you have like a fan avatar to really know who is my typical fan, how old is he or she. Where does he or she hangs out online, and all that stuff.

Tobias Rauscher:
You can even run a survey or a post or whatsoever. You need to know other interests of your fans as well. It's really important to know your fans. I cannot stress that enough. And then, you need to match it, for example, with the audiences, the different social media platforms.

Michael Walker:
All right, let's take a quick break from the podcast. I can tell you about a free, special offer that we're doing right now, exclusively for our podcast listeners.

Michael Walker:
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Michael Walker:
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Michael Walker:
Yeah, that's so smart. Yeah. To reiterate something you just said too that, I think, is so important, is like understanding your fans and knowing who they are and connecting with... Yeah. I feel like that's something that if you haven't done yet, one of the first things I would recommend doing. If you're looking to grow your audience, or to discover more about who your fans are, where they hang out, then, have a conversation on Zoom with, at least, 20 of your fans, and just ask them these questions.

Michael Walker:
Just get to know them. Ask them questions about their musical taste, about what they're interested in, get to know them, and make a list of those 20 people that you had a conversation with. And that's probably going to give you more real... What's the word like... There's different kinds of data. Like one is based on quality of just like under that direct connection. That face to face like personal connection is such a good way to go deep and really connect with someone and understand them.

Michael Walker:
And... I forget where I've heard this, but something like, I think surveys too are just so valuable. If you can run surveys, if you have a big enough database, or like enough fans and you have all their phone numbers or emails, sending out surveys is so powerful. But if you don't have a thousand or 10,000 fans yet, then, just reaching out directly and asking them if they have a free moment in the next couple of weeks, would they be interested to hop on a quick call.

Tobias Rauscher:
Yeah.

Michael Walker:
That's such a good advice.

Tobias Rauscher:
And one tip is as well to... For example, let's say you are just starting out, you don't really have fans yet. Then, I recommend to just check out other similar artists that make similar music and look at their fans, watch concert videos. Look who's following them on Instagram, TikTok or Facebook or whatsoever. And then, you learn about these kind of fans of similar artists. And this usually helps you as well, especially if you don't have a big fan base yet.

Michael Walker:
Oh my gosh, yeah, that's super smart. The super smart too is that if you don't have an audience yet, doing that research and figuring out who are their most engaged fans, and if you come at it from a point of... Like the wrong way to do it is just like spamming them and be like, "Hey, check out my music."

Michael Walker:
The right way to do it is like you reach out to those people and you introduce yourself, say, "Hey, just wanted to reach out and get in touch," and ask them about themselves, start a conversation, and then, lead from there into asking if they'd be willing to hop on a quick call to just connect, get to know each other, so you can go a little bit deeper on those questions.

Michael Walker:
Then, you could actually reach out to like the super fans of other artists like you, and probably, build a real fan relationship with that person and understand them better. That's super smart. Yeah. Cool. Yeah. Music-map.com is a great resource. Yeah, I got to recommend... Checking that out as a way to research similar artists like you.

Michael Walker:
Yeah, polite stalking. I think that if you're transparent and you just do it from a place where you're not actually trying to... It's not about like me, it's really, you're trying to connect and just network and get to know them, and you have that point of view, then, usually, people can feel that. And if they're a fan of music, then, if you make music that is similar to that artist, then, they're probably going to like your music too. They're probably going to think it's cool that you're reaching out to them, that you're looking to actually build a real relationship.

Michael Walker:
Cool. Let's talk a little bit... Yeah. I know that a couple of questions are coming in, and this is just a big question on challenges around visibility and kind of that attraction of like new people, I'm trying to figure out like how do I get my music, and how do I grow my audience and reach new listeners.

Michael Walker:
So, I'd love to hear you talk about what are some of the best strategies, or the best overall methods you found to help an artist who, let's assume that they do have high quality music right now that's competitive, recorded, well produced, and now, they're just trying to figure out like how do I reach new people, or actually, connect with the right fans.

Tobias Rauscher:
Yeah. Yeah. First of all, I would say we need to select the metrics we are looking at, because a lot of musicians just want to get a lot of followers. So, that's the main goal. But that actually isn't always the smartest thing to do. There is this principle of the 1,000 real fans. So, it's much more important to get a few, a handful of really, let's say, hyper... How you call them? Like super fans, more or less, that buy your stuff, that follow you, that come to your concert. And then, you can be much more successful with just like 1,000 super fans than a million followers.

Tobias Rauscher:
I saw this so often, I see it so often that you have artists with a million followers in Instagram and all that stuff, and they are broke. They cannot manage, monetize it as well. And then, I see a lot of artists you've probably never heard of, and they have a small, but really dedicated following, and they're really successful. They're making six figures. So, if you just have 1,000 fans that give you like 100 bucks per year, you have a six figure in music business.

Tobias Rauscher:
And so, sometimes, it's really good to get a different focus or a mindset shift. It's not always about the quantity and getting more and more followers and likes, it's more about really building a deep connection, and then, monetizing, or then to monetize your fan base as well. And then, you can be super successful as well. And then, you can have money that you can use on ads, which kind of, has this snowball effect, because when you run ads, you automatically get more and more likes and more followers and all that stuff. But then, you make money back in return.

Tobias Rauscher:
Yeah, this is really important before you just focus on the growth strategies to get more and more followers. So, I think this is really the first set that you need to do. And then, of course, it's important as well to get more and more followers. And like I said in the beginning, then, we have the organic methods and the paid methods. So, with paid channels, it's actually really easy. You basically push a button, and you can show your music and your ads to people who are highly likely to like your music. And this is, then, really a magic thing.

Tobias Rauscher:
The biggest mistake, or issue is often that musicians just advertise their music and send people for example, to their Spotify, but the problem is you often, always spend more money than you make back. So, if you don't have a funnel in place to really make a return on your ad spend, so, ideally, you want to spend 1,000 bucks per month on ads and make 3,000 back, then, you spend 5,000 per month on ads and make 10 or 15k back, and then, you can grow it. But if you just spend money each and every month to just get a few new followers on Spotify or whatsoever, it's not really economical, and it doesn't matter.

Tobias Rauscher:
Yeah, this is one important thing I always see like a big mistake. And on the other hand, when we use organic grow strategies, it, of course, depends on the channel. When it comes to YouTube, one of the really important things is, and I recommend any musician to really focus on YouTube, you need to have this kind of wow factor. You need to create a video which makes people want to share your video. This is really important.

Tobias Rauscher:
And the other thing is you need to get the first view yourself on it. You have to push people, your fans to basically to your video and make some buzz. Because, for example, on YouTube, in the beginning, the algorithm has no data. Once the algorithm of YouTube has enough data, YouTube can recommend your videos and your music to other people. But without any data, it will never start picking up.

Tobias Rauscher:
So, in the beginning, it's really key to have well working videos that have this wow factor, and then, to push people on the video, to give the algorithm really some data. So, at least, a thousand views, that are 2,000 or more, and then, the algorithm can analyze, okay, how much watch time are your video, or does your video get on average and all that? And if the watch time is good, if the engagement is good, then, YouTube is, or the algorithm like, hey, that's some good content. Let's show to more and more people. Because YouTube, of course, wants a lot of people to stay as long as possible on the platform.

Tobias Rauscher:
And if your videos help YouTube to achieve that goal, it's a win-win situation. And then, YouTube really starts recommending your video over and over. Like I said, like even after 10 years, YouTube is still recommending your video. But in the beginning, you have to have a good launch strategy. So, to create anticipation and all that stuff, bring your own crowd to YouTube to give the YouTube or YouTube's algorithm enough data. And then, yeah, things will pick up. Then, you need to optimize your video. You need to optimize the channel, text, and all that, of course, launch it in the right way. But this is usually the way to go.

Tobias Rauscher:
First of all, bring your own traffic in order to give YouTube enough data, and then, YouTube starts recommending your video. And it's really important, you cannot really trick the algorithm. It's really important that you have quality content. And even more important than this is that your content is a share-worthy, so that people want to show that music to other friends. Because then, you have this kind of multi, like replicator, whatsoever, so that more and more people watch your music. So, YouTube gets more watch time, or your videos get more watch time. And in return, YouTube is starting to promote your video, or to recommend your video.

Tobias Rauscher:
And this is really once you made this, it's like, it's magic. It's really crazy, because you will get new fans each and every day. And these are not random fans, because YouTube recommends new music to fans who are highly likely to like your music. So, this is a real powerhouse, and this is, in a nutshell, like how-

Michael Walker:
I love it. It's so good. Awesome. It sounds like there's a bunch of stuff to unpack there, a lot of like gold nuggets. And also, I see some questions coming in the chat, which are great too. So, to reiterate, it sounds like when it comes to paid traffic, the point that you're making is that if you're paying money to send people to Spotify or a platform like that, the return on that, every click that you pay for is very small, because you're getting paid less than a penny per stream.

Michael Walker:
So, just economically, your cost per click is going to be high and your earnings per click is going to be low. And it seems like that's really just... That's the whole equation of paid traffic, like how much are you paying for the click, how much are you earning per the click? So, if you're paying like X amount per click, and you're only earning like a fraction of a penny per click, then, yeah, it's almost impossible to be successful with it. We totally should catch up...

Michael Walker:
Tobias, we've just launched a funnel platform called StreetTeam, and basically replace click funnels with our own funnels that, and now, it's tied in to the traffic. So, that exactly what you're talking about. You're speaking my language. So that people, rather than just sending them to a platform you don't own, building a platform on Spotify, and essentially, someone else owns your audience, like actually setting them to your own platform, and your earnings per click are just going to be so much higher than if you're paying a fraction of a penny, or if you're getting a fraction of a penny per stream.

Michael Walker:
So, I would love to connect with you at some point in the next few weeks and just geek out and talk through this stuff.

Tobias Rauscher:
Sure.

Michael Walker:
But yeah, and then, it seems like what you're saying about YouTube, really, one of the main benefits is that it's a great platform in terms of, one, it's a good place, it's like a testing ground in terms of figuring out what's actually valuable. You don't have to pay a bunch of money to be able to figure out what's working, right?

Michael Walker:
So, it's a great place to start, to figure out what's working for you. And as long as you are creating content and you're improving the content based on what people find valuable, what's relevant to them, then, over time, the algorithm also automatically finds the people who are resonating with your music, and are actually watching based on the amount of time that they spent watching the video.

Michael Walker:
So, it gets better over time, and you actually build this automatic system that's recommending your music for you. Super cool.

Tobias Rauscher:
And here-

Michael Walker:
One question... oh yeah.

Tobias Rauscher:
I just wanted to add two more tips. Because I know one of the common issues of some of my coaches is as well, if they don't have a big fan base, if they're just starting out, they just don't have a lot of power to push on YouTube. So, here, two strategies that I recommend to do, the first is to cover songs that are popular right now and give them your own twist.

Tobias Rauscher:
For example, I don't know, there is a new Taylor Swift or Justin Bieber song or whatsoever. Now, a lot of people Googling for that song on YouTube, searching for that song. And then, maybe you have an unplugged version, or a cool beatbox version, or a jazz version, or a metal version of that song. And then, people, they are intrigued.

Tobias Rauscher:
They click on your video, and you get a lot of views, because it's like a big wave coming on. YouTube searching for the new, I don't know, the weekend song or whatsoever. And then, just imagine, your video, your unplugged cover of that pops up like two or three videos below that, or it gets recommended in the recommended cipher or something like this, and this can be really powerful.

Tobias Rauscher:
And the other one is to team up, so that's tip number one. Because this makes you more likely to get this covered. And you, yeah, leverage the big wave that comes in searches. And the other one is to collaborate. Collaborate, for example, with people who have an audience already. Okay. You can contact them. Sometimes, it's even worth paying for that exposure. Maybe you do a collaboration with them, or just asking them to send a shout out or whatsoever. And can you pay promotion as well?

Tobias Rauscher:
But it's just really important to think in the beginning of how you can get a lot of traffic on your video to get the first, ideally, 10K views, but, at least, a couple of thousand views. Because before that, the algorithm won't start working, and then, you will never really get it up in a good way. Yeah, this is what you can do to get some views in the beginning when nobody knows you.

Michael Walker:
Super smart. Yeah. And I know firsthand from experience too that what you're talking about is so true with, figuring out where the wave is already has momentum, like doing cover songs of popular songs. There's a bunch of people searching for it. That was how we got probably 15 or 16 million views from our YouTube channels from like covering popular songs. And those views, they turned into an original fan base that helped us sold out headlining tour.

Michael Walker:
That's one thing that... There's a couple of things that I would love to dive into on that route, which... One of the questions is around this idea of the wow factor, the wow factor, and creating content that makes people want to share it, it has that... Because it's so easier... Like one of the biggest mistakes that I know that you see all the time is people, they're like, okay, cool. I'll do a cover of this popular song. And then, they just cover it and make it sound exactly like the original, or just a worst quality version of the song, and it's, okay, what is this really bringing to the table?

Michael Walker:
I would love to hear you talk about what is it, in your view, that contributes to that wow factor? And how can someone... especially if someone is starting on YouTube and they don't have a big budget to put into production and maybe some things that they think go into that wow factor, what are some ways that they can create that wow factor, so that they can gain more exposure from it?

Tobias Rauscher:
Yeah. One thing would be, for example, to tap into emotions. This is usually what works really well. If you've seen, for example... What's the name? Is it Monsters? James Blunt's last song, where he's really crying and all that stuff, and all the reaction videos to it. This is super emotional. So, a lot of people share this. Or it can be something that is just different, unexpected. Something... Think about yourself. Like which kind of videos did you share with your families or friends the last time, and why did you do it? What triggered you to share this kind of music videos? What was it?

Tobias Rauscher:
Usually, it's like we want to, we are all like private groups, so to say. And if we share something, we get some social points, let's say, because we were the discoverer, we found out about this cool, new, sad video or happy video, funny video whatsoever, and then, we share it. And you need this kind of, that triggers this primal desire to share, to shout it out, and share it with your friends, your fans and other people.

Tobias Rauscher:
And usually, for example, what works really well is if you see these puppy videos, whether it's the dog rescue videos, where they find, for example, a really poor, almost dead, half dead puppy. And then, in the end, it goes to you. It's so sad. And then, there's this shift. And then, you see this happy dog in the end. And this is such a strong emotion. And then, people engage with it and share it. Of course, we cannot do this with our music, but we need to trigger this.

Tobias Rauscher:
And for example, with my music, I'm just not playing the guitar and doing like fingerstyle tapping, I do percussive stuff on the guitar, and this has this wow factor, because people are like, wow, I've never seen somebody play the guitar like this. And then, they share it. And they're like, "Hey, dude. Check out this guitarist," or whatsoever. Or for example, Alexandr Misko, he's a fingerstyle guitarist as well, and he does really amazing fingerstyle covers of popular songs.

Tobias Rauscher:
And he has some... If you've never checked him out, check him out, and he racks up millions and millions of views because, then, it's, for example, your favorite, I don't know... For example, the theme of Pirates of the Caribbean or something but in the fingerstyle version.And this triggers people to share with their friends, because they're, this is so cool. Or they had like a bow for a violin playing on the acoustic guitar.

Tobias Rauscher:
So, something unusual. And this is can be, for example, done, let's say you make a jazz version or a metal version of a pop song, to give it your twist, to make it special. And then, you're like, "Hey, check this out. That's the jazz version of The Weeknd song or whatsoever, but then, with your personality. Or [inaudible 00:34:13] for example, or Boyce Avenue, they basically make unplugged, really nice unplugged cover videos of popular songs and something like this.

Tobias Rauscher:
So, you need to find these triggers. So, if you make or produce a video, ask yourself, would you share that? Why would people share it? And what could you add? Sometimes, it can be really simple. There's this cool video of a street drummer, has just some paint buckets, but he's absolutely killing it, really shitty video quality and all that, but this triggers these emotions. Like check out this dude over here, check out his skills and all that. So, it could be like with great skills, great guitar solos, whatsoever. Something unexpected like a jazz or metal version of a pop song, or a twist or whatsoever, a medley.

Tobias Rauscher:
So, just think... But it's really difficult to say, because it always depends on what kind of music you are doing, and what kind of twist you could give it. But you need to find these shared triggers. So, ask yourself, why should people share this? And can I add something emotional, or a unexpected twist to it, so that makes it more share worthy.

Michael Walker:
Yep. That's so good. I just shared a link in the chat of a YouTube video of... I don't know if you guys ever seen this one, this drummer is at the wrong gig. But as you're talking about the drummer and the wow factor, I just had to share it, it just cracks me up. And this community would probably appreciate this video just because it's this drummer, he's just losing his mind. And it's like, I don't know, you guys have to watch it.

Michael Walker:
But that's so true, it's so smart. It sounds like what you're saying is that, really, a wow factor, it comes from this wanting to share it. Like why do people want to share something? Usually, because of the way that they want to gain social status points, or the way that it reflects on them and their identity. Maybe everyone doesn't consciously think like I'm going to get 20 social points if I share this. But like biologically, like we're driven, like we have these social cues. And if you really analyze it, you look at your own habits and behavior when you're sharing, like that's what's happening.

Michael Walker:
So that's super smart, put things through that filter of, would I share this, and is this shareable? Is this something that has that wow factor? And it sounds like one of the main factors... So, a couple of things you said like the emotion... If there's something really emotional that triggers an emotional response, then, a lot of times, that's something that becomes shareable and just the unexpected. There's something about that unexpected, or like that twist, right? Where that's the thing where...

Michael Walker:
I read about this somewhere. I think that we've probably talked about this before, Tobias, but there's this article that was talking about the traits of virality and shareability. And one thing that they had found was that, like one of the common characteristics was that there was this combination of familiar, plus unique. Like when something went viral or when something was really shareable or when it comes that wow factor, a lot of times, it needs that familiar aspect. Because that's the thing that attaches to something in our brain that already exists.

Michael Walker:
So it's like familiar, so everyone can recognize it. So it's more like, oh yeah, like I recognize that thing. Like a viral quiz might be like which Disney princess are you? Like, the reason that... Like it's familiar in the sense that everyone knows, like we have this context of Disney princesses, but now, it's about you. And it has that shareability, because, now, it says something about me, that familiar aspect.

Michael Walker:
When you're describing this one strategy of doing this, it's really about finding the familiar trending songs that they recognize, that like everyone's listening to right now. You plug into that familiar thing that's happening in our brains, there's these groove. We're going down a hill and there's a sled and it hits these groove. And then, if all you do is a familiar, then, there's nothing unique, or there's nothing really special about it. So, there's nothing that makes people go, wow.

Michael Walker:
So, it's like that mix of having something that's familiar that catches that groove. But then, having something that veers off the track in a compelling, or like in a pleasant way, or surprising way that makes you go, oh whoa, I wasn't expecting that. So, super interesting when it comes to cover songs, like thinking about that, okay, like I could cover this song, but I want to do it in a way that makes people... that's surprising or unique or makes them go wow, super smart.

Tobias Rauscher:
Yeah. And a thing that I can add, again, let's say you have a video with viral qualities, and we talked about how important it is to get a lot of views, and once it is, you need to get as many views in the first 48 hours on the video, because after that, your chances for success, so that the YouTube's algorithm really picks up your video and recommends it to other people is much lower. So, you should really have a launch strategy. Maybe announce that you are going to launch a video like in one week from now. You send some behind the scenes stuff.

Tobias Rauscher:
And then, even on the launch day, you could do little like giveaway or something like this, for example, yeah, I just play this fingerstyle song, music, and usually, what I sell is the tabs. So, there's a sheet music for guitarists that want to learn how to play it. And a lot of my fans are a guitarist themselves. And then, I offer the first thousand people to get the tab for free. So, the people really wanted to watch the video right when it was launched, so I gave them an incentive to watch it as soon as possible to get actually more views within the first 48 hours to push my video, to give it a boost.

Tobias Rauscher:
And so, this is once, again, really important. And another tip I can give you, it's a little bit more technical, but, for example, if, let's say, you cover a video, what you want to do is to include the video, like the artist name and the title of the song in your description and in your text as well. Because YouTube works on channel clusters, you have different channel clusters, and of course, the algorithm can just work with your data.

Tobias Rauscher:
And so, you tell YouTube's algorithm, hey look, our videos are connected. Because the algorithm can read what you put in the description and in the meta text, and this helps you as well to let YouTube's algorithm know that your videos are connected. And then, your chances increase that YouTube recommends your video next to the original video. And once you get, or your video gets recommended by YouTube, you will get so many views. It's just insane. This happened me a couple of times as well.

Tobias Rauscher:
And so, you want to get there. So, when it comes to YouTube, there are different strategies like content-wise, of course, then, how you promote it. And some technical aspects as well, like video channel optimization and all that stuff that help you to, yeah, become really successful on YouTube.

Michael Walker:
That's awesome. So, one question... I'm sure you get this question a lot, especially when it comes to the cover songs and whether that's legal or the royalties. I think someone asked that question, when you cover songs, do you pay royalties for that? Is it okay if I do cover songs of other people's songs? So, could you speak a little bit to that just in terms of what are people allowed to do when it comes to cover songs on YouTube, what are they not allowed to do?

Tobias Rauscher:
Yeah. What you're not really allowed to do is to take the original song, it's still possible to do it, but who wants to do it? You want to push your own music. And if you create music with your own twist, that's all legal. Like you find so many people, you can just Google some licensing, license... How you pronounce that word? Licensing companies.

Michael Walker:
Yeah.

Tobias Rauscher:
You can basically even get the license to play it, but that's not an issue at all. So, it's all legal. If you create your own fingerstyle, fingerstyle or guitar cover version whatsoever, that's no issue as well. You have this content ID claim, so what could happen is that your video gets claimed, and then, you just cannot monetize it, but it's still there and you get views and you get the attention. You just don't get the money.

Tobias Rauscher:
But yeah, that's... Like money on YouTube is not really what we are aiming for, because ideally, we monetize our music in a different way, because it's, of course, not a lot of money you get. But in the worst case, you cannot monetize your video or the other party, let's say, monetizes the video and gets the share.

Tobias Rauscher:
But it is, yeah. A lot of people think it's not possible, but it's definitely possible.

Michael Walker:
Yep. Yep. Super smart. And I think it really speaks to the conversation that we've been having throughout this event so far about kind of those three different stages of marketing. I think Adam Ivy described it as like visibility, connection and offer. It's also the formulas for like attracts, engage, monetize. And like different platforms, different strategies of different channels, they have different purposes.

Michael Walker:
And so, it sounds like when it comes to cover songs, the purpose of it, isn't like you're trying to immediately monetize this cover song. If so, then, that's an issue, right? Like you're not able to... if you did, I don't know, try to... I know you can put cover songs on Spotify and other platforms, but then, there's more royalties. You have to figure out that part.

Michael Walker:
I think on DistroKid, it's pretty easy to do it. But when it comes to attraction and connection and kind of building that audience, that's really what these cover songs are for, for that initial visibility, reaching these new people. I would love to talk a little bit about the bridge, or the transition between YouTube as a platform that is a great place to build a community or build a relationship to attract, be discovered by new people.

Michael Walker:
What about that next step of monetizing that audience or... Yeah. What's the strategy in terms of how do you interface with YouTube in a way that allows you to actually have a sustainable income?

Tobias Rauscher:
Yeah, yeah. Of course, ideally, you want to own your traffic all the time. Okay. You don't want to have Facebook, Instagram or TikTok, or you own your fans because if these platforms go down, your fan base is lost. So, you need to get the fans in your own ecosystem. Still, one of the best ways to do it is having an email list. So, you own the contact address or the getting the phone numbers and all that stuff.

Tobias Rauscher:
So, what I recommend to do is to give people advantages to sign up, for example, to your email list. What I do is, for example, I offer people who watch my YouTube videos, free tabs, for example, or sometimes, free lessons or all that stuff. And then, they check out your homepage or your landing page, sign up, and then, you own the fan. Okay. So, you need to try to get fans off of YouTube. This is important.

Tobias Rauscher:
But on the other hand, you are hurting in a way your channel's growth because, of course, YouTube doesn't like it if the people are leaving YouTube. So, it's always like a, yeah, a little tricky thing, but that's still what you need to do. I would... for example, you can post music in between. I, for example, upload different content, like, for example, tutorials, and these are especially to get people off of YouTube, and then, sign up.

Tobias Rauscher:
You could, for example, offer them an unpublished song or behind the scenes tour video, or like a secret insider community. And then, people sign up, and then, you have them in your own system. But you always have to have a little bribe to get people off of the platform into your own system. So, the key is really, and there, we are closing the loop with that you have to see your music business as a business. It is a business, and you need to get customers in your own system. You need to own your fan base.

Tobias Rauscher:
And therefore, one of the key things you need to do is to get people into your own system. This is really... It's so important. Yeah, because as well, the organic reach is declining all the time. Like, for example, I remember back when I had 5,000 likes on Facebook back then, like up to a thousand people like the post. And then, at some point, I hit 140,000 likes, and now, like a couple of hundred people max like my post.

Tobias Rauscher:
So, it's like the organic view is declining so sharply. And the same happens to Instagram and other platforms. You always have this peak. It's all good, all great, and then, they go down, they monetize and they ask you for money for that. And then, you are lost. Your fan base is lost.

Tobias Rauscher:
So, you need to get your fans in your own system, you need to own your fans. This is, yeah, extremely important. And then, once the people, or your fans are in your own system, you have all the power. You can send them special offers, you can survey them. You get a much higher reach than the organic reach, for example, on Facebook or Instagram, and all that stuff. And you are not risking so much that the platform goes down or changes some policies or whatsoever, get your fans in your own system, then, you can monetize them. And it's just the best way to... Yeah.

Tobias Rauscher:
Use these channels to get more exposure and get more fans, but then, get them into your own system as soon as possible.

Michael Walker:
1,000%. Yeah, that's super smart. I'm super excited to... I feel like if this conversation could happen literally right before the final presentation on the last day where we're talking about the StreetTeam CRM platform that we built, literally exactly that purpose in mind. So you don't have to rely on Mark Zuckerberg to own your audience, right? Like you're building your own platform that you own. And this is something that's... this a new idea. Like every successful business owner understands this at a pretty deep level.

Michael Walker:
It's like their audience, their contact list, their CRM with email and phone numbers, and their contact. And the lifetime value of the people in their list is so important. Yeah, super good advice from Tobias. And also, great advice too just in terms of like how do you get people, transfer people from that platform to other platform? You offer something valuable. You offer something in exchange for them joining.

Michael Walker:
So, in your case, you had the tutorials and the freebies. You even had like the urgency built into it. So, it's like the only first thousand people. Super smart. You talked a little bit about this idea, and I would love to hear your thoughts on this, because I don't know if there's a perfect answer, but it's something that is an important one, is with almost all these platforms, they have a built in incentive to keep people on their own platform. So, they want... and sometimes, it's not even there's a person specifically who's doing this. It's just the way that the algorithm works automatically, is like it's designed to promote things, that keep people engaging on their platform.

Michael Walker:
For example, on Facebook, if you share a link to an outside website, and just organically, in general, like it's almost not even worth posting on Facebook, in my opinion, unless you have a good paid traffic strategy, but also, with YouTube or any platform, really, it's like, if you post a link outward and it means that, their signals say, wow, okay, this is leading to less engagement on the platform and they diminish, or they hurt your chances to reach those people, what are your recommendations be for balancing that? You said create maybe specific content for that purpose only. But then, does that mean that their platform will just not send anyone like content, because they know, okay, everyone's going to that video and they just stay balanced.

Michael Walker:
So, like we're not going send you to that video. Is that where you think, maybe having some sort of retargeting or like paid traffic strategy might be beneficial? Or what would be your thoughts in terms of that question too? Is there a good combination with like organic, and then, paid traffic on YouTube as well? Or what are your thoughts around that whole thing?

Tobias Rauscher:
Yeah. First of all, I think it's not that dramatic if you, of course, have people and get them off of YouTube, offer them something. So, if you have a couple of videos... Let's say you had people that watched your first video, and this video, introduces them to you, and then, they probably click on your channel, watch other videos. And then, maybe the third video is something, in my case, might be a tutorial, for example. And then, the people want to get the tabs, and bam, they're in my system. But maybe your first video didn't have this call to action, but still, I would just include it.

Tobias Rauscher:
If you have a good freebie, I think it doesn't really hurt you too bad. And then, to combine channels is always the best in any case. So ideally, you have these organic growth strategies, plus paid channels. And you can, of course, use paid channels to re-target people as well, which is all possible. The thing is always... Like in the beginning, when I work with artists, of course, they don't have a big budget to use paid.

Tobias Rauscher:
And then, I say, "Hey, let's first really focus on organic growth" because you don't really have to pay, but then... And if you have a funnel, you make your first bucks, and then, you notice, okay, hey, my music funnel works and make money. And then, they have money to spend. And then, we can scale this using paid advertising on YouTube, on Google, on Facebook, Instagram, and all that stuff.

Tobias Rauscher:
And, yeah, you can definitely re-target and do all the fancy stuff there. But usually, it helps to have people on your... You need to get people on your own website so to say. Because there are the pixels on it, and then, you can basically re-target them. Or if they watch a certain amount of your video, for example, you re-target people who watch like 70% of your video, then, all that stuff. But this is like really nerdy right now. And this is all the, yeah, paid advertising strategies. But there's a lot you can do, but yeah, I would say, yeah, definitely combine both ideally.

Michael Walker:
Yeah. That makes a ton of sense. And I think you're totally right too. Just in terms of like places for people, if you're just getting started, and especially if you don't have a budget which the majority of people who are just getting started, you don't necessarily have a budget, and certainly, you don't have income coming in from your music when you just get started where it can make sense to start with organic and get something, working, get some money coming in first.

Michael Walker:
I think that there's a balance too of... Like maybe there's a case where if someone already has really high quality music and they have a budget and they're willing to invest, they just need to know like, how do I invest this in the right way? And like how do I actually do this, like from the start, so I don't spend tens of thousand of dollars, but actually, like I have a good system.

Michael Walker:
Or there might be a case where for a person like that, as long as they have a good system, then, it might be a way to save time, that if you're either like trading like time or money, so if you don't have money, then, trade your time. Don't make excuses like, oh, I can't be successful because I don't have money. It's like, no. You can. You just, now, you're going to have to trade your time.

Michael Walker:
And so, like you get enough money to be able to buy back your time. So, I think that what you're sharing is just really encouraging and on point for anyone. If your excuse is, oh, I don't have enough money to be successful. I can't do this. No. You can. It just means that you're going to have to trade your time first and get it working. But history is riddled with everyone like you who was able to do that. It just, it takes your persistence, and the right mindset.

Michael Walker:
And it takes having the right strategy too, which is why you guys being here right now, connecting with Tobias, and learning these strategies based on everything that's working, it's going to save you so much time and heartbreak from like... is that, oh, I'm not good enough, because my music's not getting heard. No. It's like you just... Maybe you didn't intentionally create a video with the wow factor. So people, it just wasn't really something that, noteworthy for them to go wow and share it. Cool.

Michael Walker:
One final question for you. And usually, we do Q&A segment throughout this. I feel like we've had an opportunity to answer a lot of the questions that kind of came in through here already, just by kind of like keeping in touch with the chat. But maybe one final question that would be helpful is around that final stage.

Michael Walker:
Let's say that someone has built an audience or they have some good channels for traffic. Maybe they even have millions of views on their YouTube channel. And now, they're looking at monetizing it, and maybe let's say that they even had a little bit of a bridge or a system. So, they have a lead magnet, or they had something where they're growing their own audience, and now, they're like, how do I make money from this? Or like, how do I actually monetize this audience?

Michael Walker:
Maybe you could share a quick tip or outline around that stage there when someone's ready to start monetizing it, what's one thing that you found that's working really well right...

Tobias Rauscher:
I got you correctly, it's about the funnel.

Michael Walker:
Yes.

Tobias Rauscher:
Like once you get people in your system or...

Michael Walker:
So, once they're on the platform that you own, what does the process look like for them to go from a contact or go from a fan, a subscriber to like actually a customer?

Tobias Rauscher:
Yeah. You basically need to have a fan funnel so to say. Let's say a hundred people get on your email list, so to say, of course, not all these people become super fans. So, you lose people on every step. That's why we call it a funnel. But what you need to do is first to connect. So before someone becomes a customer, there are some research and metrics there that say you need to have, at least, seven touch points.

Tobias Rauscher:
So, you need to send them some value, give some cool free stuff, give some cool videos, some cool content. And you can all automate this with email sequence and with email automation. So, there are email service providers like, for example, ActiveCampaign, and somebody signs up to your list, and then, they get the first value email. Two days later, they get another email and all that stuff.

Tobias Rauscher:
And then, for example, after two weeks, let's say you have a special offer, which can be automated as well. And then, people have, for example, five days or three days time, to, for example, buy a special, a VIP bundle or whatsoever, or a cool merch bundle or whatever kind of products you have. But this is really important as well, you need to have products as well, or services that you sell.

Tobias Rauscher:
So, it's not your music that you make your money off. Like it's really... Nowadays, music is basically free thing to get, like people can listen to your music for free on YouTube, and pretty much for free on Spotify, on all that. Okay. So, music is like a free lead magnet. So, that gets people in your system. But now, in order to make really money, you need to, first, build a connection, and then, offer them something. You need to sell products. This can be, of course, your physical albums, the new specials, even cassettes for vintage lovers, or some merch bundles.

Tobias Rauscher:
Or here, it's really important, one key factor or one thing, so many musicians get wrong. They think of products they like, but they don't really listen to their audience. You need to find out what is it that my audience wants. Do they want a sticker, or wristband, or whatsoever it might be. But might be not the case. That's, again, why it's so important to know your audience, to, then, be able to know and maybe ask your fans directly what they want from you. Is it live stream concert? Is it like merch?

Tobias Rauscher:
Maybe your fans don't even wear merch, usually like younger people, for example, or posters, or whatsoever. So, it's really hard to pinpoint, but you need to have several products that you offer. And then, usually, it's best to bundle them as well. And don't have... Sometimes, I see huge online shops with hundred products, but it's key to rather focus on getting more money and putting a lot of value, so bundling a lot of value together. And then, you get more money up front. So, you really sell a product, let's say a merch bundle for 50 bucks including your CDs or whatsoever. And now, when you have 50 bucks, then, you can use to spend, for example, on Facebook ads, which gets more fans in your system.

Tobias Rauscher:
And then, again, this snowball starts rolling, but you need to think like a business, you need to have services. And it can be... For example, in my case, because I play the guitar and a lot of my fans, like I said, are guitarists as well, and then, I started selling guitar lessons. So I created an online guitar academy as well, like a membership platform, because I knew, hey, okay, this is something my fans really love. And then, this is how you really make money.

Tobias Rauscher:
So, you need to have product or services. It can be as well, consulting, coaching, vocal training, music production. There's so many opportunities out there, or options, but yeah, this is really important that your fans, you need to know what they really want. And then, once they're in your system, then, you have the chance to sell to them. It's a value exchange. Okay? So, it's just, you give them something for value, which your fans love and you get money back that you can use to further grow your fan base.

Tobias Rauscher:
And something that is really easy to do is, for example, to sell like a, let's say, like access to you like an inner circle, okay? Could be a subscription for 10 bucks or 20 bucks per month or yearly price, and then, they can connect directly with you. Maybe you make live streams from behind the scenes, or when you rehearse or all that stuff. And then, they get, for example, yeah, early access to new songs, or you involved them in lyrics, or naming songs and whatsoever.

Tobias Rauscher:
So there are so many things that you can, let's say, use as product, but this is how artists nowadays really make money. And you see a lot of... Or for example, shout outs. I often get approached for people who pay me 200 bucks, for example, recording like a two-minute video and playing happy birthday on the guitar and sending customized videos or something like this, this as well, a platform of me out there, or really like Snoop Dog and really big artists doing exactly this. Or you see this... Even Metallica is now on masterclass.com selling an online course on how to form a band and all that stuff.

Tobias Rauscher:
So today, it's really about having a business. Your music is your brand, and you as an artist, but you need to sell things your audience really likes. So you need to become a business. And this is how you can make really a lot of money, even if you have a small fan base. Or it can be private concerts. I can go on forever with it, or masterminds. Like you go to... Like we did in Costa Rica.

Tobias Rauscher:
And for example, I could do a one-week percussive guitar boot camp in Costa Rica or in Austria, whatsoever. And you can charge high ticket prices for that, like three grand, five grand, whatsoever. And a fraction of your fans will love to do this, to travel with you, to be on your bootcamp, or in your mastermind or whatsoever. But this is where the fun starts to begin, and this is where really the money comes in.

Michael Walker:
Mic drop. It's so good. It's good you guys have the replay. You have 24 hours to re-watch this and kind of take notes of every single idea, the offers that were shared or things worth considering as a starting point.

Michael Walker:
And I especially love... really, your main point is that you need to figure out what your fans want and offer that to them. So, these are all ideas, but what matters is actually talking to your fans, connecting with them and seeing like, what do they want? And one of the best ways to do that is going back to what we talked about earlier, have a conversation with them, and actually, ask them like, what do you actually want?

Michael Walker:
So, here's a bunch of ideas. These are all seem really cool, which of these are you most interested in? Right? And having those conversations... You don't even have to like try to sell them at the beginning. It can just be about getting feedback. And sometimes, they'll actually be like, that sounds awesome, can I get that now? You're like, sure, yeah. I'll even give you a cool discount just to say thank you for helping me with it. So, super smart.

Michael Walker:
So Tobias, or Tobias, I know you go by both, but I still kind of switch those sometimes. Hey man, this has been awesome. It's always a pleasure talking with you. Appreciate you coming on here. I know that... It seems like there's something happening in the chat. I'm not sure if the link for the freebees or the resources... We might need to update it, or just make sure that it's the correct link. So, we'll work on that, getting it to you.

Michael Walker:
But for everyone who's here right now, I know that you have freebee, or resource that kind of goes deeper on everything that we talked about today, maybe you could share a little bit about, for anyone who's here right now who'd like to connect more, or look into that free resource that you shared, maybe we can talk a little bit about that.

Tobias Rauscher:
You mean the free resource I'm sharing here?

Michael Walker:
Yep.

Tobias Rauscher:
That's basically a workshop where I break it all down on a micro level, like how you set up a successful music business. Like it's a framework that I use that you, Michael use, that another successful music entrepreneurs use. So, this is how it all works. So, you can just use it, watch the workshop, and you can implement it on your own.

Tobias Rauscher:
Or of course, you find a lot of help. I can help you. Michael can help you. But yeah, I cover some of the biggest mistakes musicians do all the time, and I see it again and again. And yeah, then, I basically talk, walk you through the framework.

Michael Walker:
Dude, that's so cool. I love this landing page. Hey, look at that. It's the two of us hanging out.

Tobias Rauscher:
Yeah. That's in Costa Rica.

Michael Walker:
Awesome. Was that in Costa Rica?

Tobias Rauscher:
Yeah. Yeah.

Michael Walker:
Nice.

Tobias Rauscher:
That was in evening.

Michael Walker:
That's so cool. So, this is a workshop that you put together that... Was it from the Costa Rica one, or is it like another one?

Tobias Rauscher:
It's the new one. It's a new one. I basically updated the entire Fanbase Academy program as well. So, it's Fanbase Academy 2.0. And it's a new workshop as well. And yeah, that's basically all the stuff that you need to know. Some of that, we talked about that here as well. But yeah, I think it's pretty helpful. So definitely, check it out. Yeah. Then, you definitely understand how a six figure music business works.

Michael Walker:
Yep. Super smart. Dude, I love it. Thank you again for coming in here. I highly recommend everyone if you resonated with this, like Tobias is a super smart, sharp guy, and he's got... The proof is in the pudding, I think, when someone walks the walk, and you go and you research, you see that he's done this for himself and everything that he is teaching is based on real world results and experience, it's not just sort like ideas.

Michael Walker:
So, if this has been helpful for you, I definitely recommend checking out the free workshop. You can click on the link, and go check it out. If there are any issues with the signup process, then, we'll get them figured out for you ASAP. We'll follow up with you there. But Tobias, you're the man. Appreciate you. I'm sure I'll talk to you again. We should definitely catch up soon.

Tobias Rauscher:
Oh yeah.

Michael Walker:
I would love to connect about the StreetTeam software, which is basically, we replaced click funnels and Active Campaign with a CRM, and it could be really cool to like to plug it in to each other. Yeah. Let's just geek out, we'll talk more about that stuff.

Tobias Rauscher:
Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, let's do it.

Michael Walker:
Cool. Hey, it's Michael here. I hope that you got a ton of value at this episode. Make sure to check out the show notes to learn more about our guest today. And if want to support the podcast, then, there's a few ways to help us grow. First, if you hit subscribe, then, I'll make sure you don't miss a new episode. Secondly, if you share it with your friends on your social media, tag us, that really helps us out.

Michael Walker:
And third, best of all, if you leave us an honest review, it's going to help us reach more musicians like you who want to take their music career to the next level. The time to be a modern musician is now, and I'll look forward to seeing you on our next episode.