Kaytee Long:
PR is a marathon. It's not a sprint. But when you do take that time to cultivate those relationships, that's when you are able to have success with PR.

Michael Walker:
It's easy to get lost in today's music industry, with constantly changing technology, and where anyone with a computer can release their own music. I'm going to share with you why this is the best time to be an independent musician, and it's only getting better. If you have high quality music, but you just don't know the best way to promote yourself so that you can reach the right people and generate a sustainable income with your music, we're going to show you the best strategies that we're using right now to reach millions of new listeners every month without spending 10 hours a day on social media. We're creating a revolution in today's music industry, and this is your invitation to join me. I'm your host, Michael Walker.

Michael Walker:
All right. So I'm excited to be here today with Kaytee Long. Kaytee is the CEO and founder of DIY PR. She worked as a publicist for major recording artists and award shows like The Grammys, Billboard, and American Music Awards. She's been a featured speaker at CD Baby, Berkeley College of Music, and Women in PR. She was honored as a 2020 trailblazer publicist by Women in PR, and so she's awesome. And today I'm really excited to talk with her as an independent artist, what are some of the best opportunities nowadays to really be able to leverage publicity and PR. So Kaytee, thanks so much for taking the time to be here today.

Kaytee Long:
Thank you, Michael. It's amazing to chat with you as always. And we always have great conversations, so I'm excited .

Michael Walker:
For sure. I remember the first time we talked we ended up going down a rabbit hole that's very rare with someone that I've just met that would have that level of conversation. So it was pretty awesome.

Kaytee Long:
 I know. It was immediately I was like okay, I like this guy. He's good guy. Super fun.

Michael Walker:
That's awesome. Well it's definitely mutual. Cool. To start off with I'd love for anyone here who it's their first time meeting you or hearing about you, could you do a quick introduction of your story?

Kaytee Long:
Yeah. Absolutely. Well, I've been a publicist for over a decade. I'm losing count now. I've worked in all facets of the entertainment industry, so film and television, I've also worked in health and wellness, so there's some crossover with my current clients and wellness as well, my current music clients. And film and television campaigns for Emmys, Oscars, like you said I've worked with pretty much all of the award shows on the red carpet with talent. But my personal passion because I come from a family of artists is helping Independent artists be able to create art and make money doing it, and also get their art out there.

Kaytee Long:
Because that's the biggest thing that I heard from artists is that's really the challenge, right? And in an industry that there's a lot of hierarchy, I'm really super passionate about empowering the independents and helping them feel like they really have a shot, because you do. Look at Macklemore, look at so many, I can't even name all the artists that are now independent and really making shit happen for themselves. So it's great. And I love what I do. I meet so many incredible people, incredible artists, and it's just really inspiriting. So that's the rundown. About four years ago I had a DIY Music PR Bootcamp which was an online course, and I'll actually be relaunching that here shortly.

Kaytee Long:
But it's been a wild ride, and I work with let's see Martin Luther King Jr.'s goddaughter is an artist that I'm currently working with. She's a feature on one of my other clients, and we're doing a bunch of other pretty impactful campaigns that support social justice beliefs, and so that's a big thing for me, too, is also being able to reach more than just music media for my clients and actually reaching the masses. We can dive into all those things, I'm happy to share any tricks and trade secrets, whatever that's helpful, but just really looking at the bigger picture for my clients because that's what will help move the needle for them.

Michael Walker:
That's awesome. Well, thanks for sharing and definitely isn't it such an incredible time right now in the world as a whole, but also for musicians and independent musicians where you don't necessarily have to rely on a record label, and you can really do things independently? I mean, it's great, it really sounds like your purpose, you have a higher purpose and so the music aligns with that. But really, it's about positive ripple for the entire world which is awesome.

Kaytee Long:
It's almost like why would you sign with a record label these days? I mean, you get to keep your rights if you don't and that's incredibly important for an artist, and thank you for noticing I am very blessed to be able to work with some incredibly talented artists that also have a larger focus and a bigger picture for their music and helping others. So we just want to compound that throughout the world. Create some positive change.

Michael Walker:
Heck yeah. Now having been doing this for over a decade and working with a lot of artists, both big and independent artists who are just starting out, I'm sure that you've started to notice a lot of similarities in terms of patterns or common mistakes or challenges. So I'm curious for anyone who's listening to this right now who's maybe an independent artist and starting to consider getting into the world of PR and publicity, what are some of the biggest common challenges and mistakes that you see?

Kaytee Long:
Sure. That's a great question. The thing that comes to mind immediately is making sure that the person gives themselves enough time, because something that I think is pretty not well-known about PR unless you're right in the middle of it is that the work starts at least a month prior to your release date. So something I have to train my clients on pretty regularly is that you have to have all of your assets, so all of your music obviously, and then also your promotional materials, if you have any videos, you have to have a private link on SoundCloud for your music and whole promo photos, a bunch of other things, you have to have that all ready at least one month prior to your music coming out.

Kaytee Long:
And that'll depend on if you are working with a publicist or if you are doing it yourself, which is entirely possible for you to do, hence where DIY PR came from. It's entirely possible to do your own PR. That leads me into the next challenge which I experienced personally as well, because I started my company many moons ago without actually having contacts in the music industry. And you literally just have to trail blaze your way through this and create relationships, right? That's what it's all about, and that's what it's about in any industry, particularly in the entertainment industry. That can be a challenge for artists initially, but that's why the strategies that I teach are so effective because they are about creating relationships.

Kaytee Long:
It's not just blanket pitching and sending spam to people's emails. That's a big no-no. We can talk about that. But it's all about creating those authentic relationships with people. And when you do that, it takes time absolutely, PR is a marathon it's not a sprint, but when you do take that time to cultivate those relationships, that's when you are able to have success with PR. And a lot of writers really respect when artists are hustling. So I get a question a lot about well does it look better if I have a publicist. And I think a lot of people want to have a reach out to my publicist. But it's fun to say, but a lot of writers actually respect when it's the artist making the hustle. And there's one other challenge I'm trying to remember. I'm sure it'll come up in conversation.

Michael Walker:
Yeah. There's some really good stuff there to unpack. And I love the straightforward approach that you just shared, which is so true, is that so much of it is just about building relationships and being willing to put yourself out there, and to reach out, and to reach out on a consistent basis to build those relationships. So one question that comes up around that is for because like you mentioned especially at the beginning it can feel really challenging to initiate and build some of those relationships. And it's like well who am I? What do I have to offer? I haven't really built up much of an audience yet. For anyone who's wondering, what does the process look like for building those relationships? How do I actually build an authentic connection with these people that I want to connect with personally, but are also going to be the right network to build, so I can grow my music career?

Kaytee Long:
Well, it all starts with research, so part of the process of PR is creating a list, a media list. If you're doing your own PR you can pretty much use your media list of the entirety of your career, so it's a really important document that you create, and it's just researching writers who would be interested in listening to your music and writing about it. So that's the first step, is finding people who are authentically interested in your type of music and in independent artists, right? Because these people are getting so many email pitches a week, like hundreds, depending on how big the outlet is, maybe thousands. So it's really important to be respectful about their inbox, and only reaching out to people that are writing about artists at the current level that you're at, and then that's where you start.

Kaytee Long:
It's all about a really thoughtful email pitch and responding immediately when they respond to you, and just being on your game. And if you have a message that you wholeheartedly stand behind, then it's not going to be hard for people to see that and for them to gravitate towards you. That being said, it's also really important that you're presenting yourself in a very professional manner, and there are ways to do that with PR. There are industry standards and such, so it's important to educate yourself on that. And also, a lot of times, so I think some publicists would actually disagree with me on this, but a lot of times social media is a really great place to start building relationships.

Kaytee Long:
So with my coaching clients, what I have them do at the beginning of us working together before their music is even... it's completed, but we don't have a release date, whatever, I have them start researching writers that would be a good fit for them, and finding them on Instagram, and if that writer looks to be open to receiving new followers who are artists and such, because some writers do have their profiles on private, and if that's the case then leave them be. Email is probably the best way to do it, but if they have a pretty public profile, then start interacting with them and engaging with them, not obviously or annoyingly dare I say, but really just authentically engaging with their content and leaving little thoughtful comments, and I think that's also a really good way to start building those relationships.

Michael Walker:
Awesome. Yeah. That's super helpful. One thing that I'd be curious to hear your take on is for an email pitch, maybe you could give us an outline of what would be a perfect pitch, and what would be the worst pitch. The most common worst pitch that you see and the behind it, and the best pitch that you see.

Kaytee Long:
Totally. I love that. And actually, I will have a free download for everyone that goes over exactly what you put into a pitch. So that'll go over all of the details. So a really good pitch would be something that creates curiosity, right? So you want to invoke curiosity in a way that the person that you're writing to is like oh this is totally up my alley and I want to know more. So whether that's with your story, whether it's how you convey the release, how you describe the release and help them feel emotion when they read your pitch, and then also, you want to make sure it's short and sweet. The worst thing, the worst pitch, the worst thing you can do is create a novel of your life story, and it's just paragraph, after paragraph of just text, that's no fun. I think anyone can relate when they open something like that it's terrifying and they either delete it or they mark unread and then never come back to it. So that's definitely short, and sweet, and compelling I think are the really strong guidelines.

Michael Walker:
Yeah. It's interesting, too, because I get a lot of emails like that, too. And I'm not even someone who's receiving submissions. But there is something so different behind when you get an email and you open it up, and it's got 10 paragraphs worth of text and just mentally, you don't even really think about it, you just turn it off compared to one that's really concise and compelling, and just cuts right to the point as well.

Kaytee Long:
Absolutely. And one other thought there, and this is so key when you're reaching out to people, you need to really show interest in them and their artistry. Because they are also artists, they are also writers, and make sure that they know that you're familiar with their work, and how can you relate to them because that pitch is more about them in that moment, than it is about you.

Michael Walker:
That definitely seems like a super power, being able to shine a light on other people or to appreciate them. Us humans, that's something I don't think I've ever seen someone who's, like if you've expressed genuine appreciation, there's a difference between fake appreciation where it's not really versus an actual acknowledgment, or recognition, or appreciation that it just feels good to be appreciated.

Kaytee Long:
 Absolutely. 100%. That's how I got one... I mean, I've gotten many placements from that, but grammy.com is a big one that stands out to me, that just really acknowledging the writer for... I think she wrote a book review about something that I coincidentally ordered that morning. So it was all of these different stars aligning and telling her that, and the created this amazing conversation. She covered my artist and so it's just be genuine. That's the biggest thing. And that can be really challenging in this type of race, I guess. I think publicists actually get a really bad rap a lot of the time, especially in entertainment, because it's so... I mean, I empathize, I steer clear from that stereotype, but I empathize with it because it is such a fast paced profession. And it's just going down a rabbit hole, but it's really important to be a kind person and that's going to get you so far.

Michael Walker:
Yeah. It seems like, again, it comes back to what we were talking about, about expressing genuine appreciation, and that being such an important skill to develop. And the way that you develop that skill is the way you develop any skill, you just practice and you actually start doing it, and just having a gratitude journal of your own that in the morning or at night you write three things that you're grateful for, or you write three things you appreciate.

Kaytee Long:
I felt so much peace after doing that. That's such a great point to bring up. Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Michael Walker:
Absolutely. Yeah. I think gratitude journals are super, super valuable, and a great way to program your brain to focus on the wins and focus on the appreciation.

Kaytee Long:
I'm right there with you.

Michael Walker:
Awesome. So one thing that I wanted to ask you about, it sounds like one of the first steps that you'd recommend when you get started looking to build these relationships is that you want to make a list of all the writers that you want to reach out to. So let's say that someone is getting started here, and they want to figure out who are the right people that I should reach out to and I want to start making this list, one, how do they find out who'd be the right people for them, and two, how do they find that contact info so they can actually start reaching out to those people?

Kaytee Long:
So you want to, this is my favorite trick actually for my coaching clients, is that I tell them to go research other artists that are similar to them, play similar music, are at a similar level at their career or slightly higher. So if you're a female pop act, and you're starting out in your career, you're not going to be like, "Well Dua Lipa was featured by Billboard, and I'm going to reach out to that writer." That's going to be a waste of time for you and PR takes time and we don't want to waste your time. So not saying that won't be a possibility later in your career, but really finding people who are aligned with your messaging and where you are currently at, and researching where they have been featured is a really great place to start, and then looking at those writers, and those are the writers you add to your list.

Kaytee Long:
So as far as contact info, that can be varied. There are multiple resources for publicists, there are expensive resources like Muck Rack or Cision, or databases that we use for certain things, but truthfully a majority of the smaller music blogs are not listed on those. So you'll find me and my team just literally bootstrapping and scrolling through websites and looking for content and digging into their LinkedIn or their Instagram if they have an email listed there, or really just doing your due diligence, and it could be anywhere on the internet. Places that it could be are the website itself, so a lot of times if you click on the name of the writer in the article, it may go to their bio and it may have their email in their bio that's within the blog.

Kaytee Long:
If it's a general email, and this is not the best scenario, but if it's just an info email then a lot of times those are listed at the bottom of the website or under contact page. Large publications typically, or newspapers, local publications, typically have their editorial team, so their writers listed on a page on the website, so it'll tell you exactly who is the arts and entertainment writer or the entertainment reporter at your local TV station. And then, if those fail then basically just Google their name and see what comes up. And I think we're all pretty good at using the Google machine, so it's just about research. And it takes time, that's one of the most time consuming parts of the PR process, is building a thoughtful list.

Kaytee Long:
So what I like to do is advise people to do that in segments, so it's not super overwhelming. And give yourself, again, a lot of time to build that list. And you want it to be pretty large. PR can be a numbers game as well, because you're most likely not going to get responses from every person that you reach out to, and I want to encourage people not to get frustrated when that happens because it's honestly just part of the PR landscape. Again, because these people are receiving hundreds of pitches. So it's your job to stand out and figure out how to do that for you as an artist.

Michael Walker:
What's up, guys. So quick intermission from the podcast so I can tell you about an awesome free gift that I have for you. I wanted to share something that's not normally available to the public. They're normally reserved for our $5,000 clients that we work with personally. This is a presentation called Six Steps to Explode Your Fan Base and Make a Profit With Your Music Online. And specifically we're going to walk through how to build a paid traffic automated funnel that's going to allow you to grow your fan base online. And the system's designed to get you your first $5,000 a month with your music. We've invested over $130,000 in the past year to test out different traffic sources, and different offers, and really see what's working best right now for musicians. And so, I think it's going to be hugely valuable for you.

Michael Walker:
And so, if that's something you're interested in, in the description there should be a little link that you can click on to go get that. And the other thing I wanted to mention is if you want to do us a huge favor, one thing that really makes a big difference early on when you're creating a new podcast is if people click subscribe, then it basically let's the algorithm know that this is something that's new and noteworthy and that people actually want to hear. And so that'll help us reach a lot more people. So if you're getting value from this and you get value from the free trainings, then if you want to do us a favor I'd really appreciate you clicking the subscribe button. All right, let's get back to the podcast.

Michael Walker:
So one thing that I feel is something that comes up over and over again in a lot of different applications, but how you started was talking about have a list of references, of similar bands who are around your size or slightly bigger than you, I think that's such a valuable asset as well as a list for people to reach out to. Because you can use those references for so many different things. It could be the venues that you want to play, it could be different ideas for promotion that they do. Just like building a relationship with these bands in and of themselves, too. Too be able to collaborate with them, shows together. So I think that's just a good nugget of wisdom is started there by making that list, and it's something that you want to add to over time.

Kaytee Long:
If I can just interject there you made me think of a point that once you understand how to create a PR pitch, all it is, is a sales pitch, right? But I like to think of it as more of an authentic, you're not trying to be a used car salesman or woman, but there's a certain way to go about it where you appeal to the person. And once you learn how to do that, you can use that in any situation, including working shows or whatever it is, reaching out to labels which if you want one. I already said my piece on that. Or Spotify playlisters and curators which is also part of the PR game, or looking for a publishing deal. So it's a skill that can benefit you in all facets of the industry.

Michael Walker:
100%. Yeah. That's something really valuable to dig into, I think. Even just thinking with Modern Musician, a big part of our strategy with our business is collaborating with other music mentors. And I remember one of the first things we did was I made a big list of people like Rick Barker, and people like Graham Cochrane who had an amazing business and guidance from serving musicians. And I created a pitch, and it was a bunch of emails, and I reached out and followed up with them, and there's a follow up process. So I think that what you're saying is spot on with just this as a general skillset and something you can adapt to reach out to anyone that you want to start building a relationship with is so valuable.

Michael Walker:
And one thing I wanted to reaffirm as well was when you talked about don't be discouraged if you reach out to someone and you don't hear back right away. In fact, that's something that I'd love to dig in a little bit deeper with you in terms of the reach out process. Do you have a process for let's say that you have that list, a database of people to reach out to, what's your process look like for reaching out, and then if they don't follow up do you have a follow up? Do you have one or two follow ups? Or then you can move them off, you're like okay I'm done following up for now? What does that look like for you?

Kaytee Long:
So follow ups are probably the most important part because generally speaking a majority of my placements, unless I'm really tight with the writer, a majority of my placements and when I'm cultivating new relationships, because I still do that. There are always new writers, I always have new clients, new genres, it's an ongoing thing, it's a lot of the placements come from the follow up. So typically I'll follow up two to three times. It depends how much time we have, what the campaign is, right? If it's a writer that I'm like yes, I just need this person to look at this pitch and they'll be sold, then I'm going to keep following up. But that being said, once I've done that and if I don't receive a response, I just let it be.

Kaytee Long:
There's no, again, playing into their busy schedule and just the business of the industry in general, there's no reason to get sassy. That's number one. I see a lot of people get sassy. I'm like no, that's not how we do this. Just don't take it personal. We all need each other to make this world go around and it's nothing personal. Actually, I spoke to one of my writer friends yesterday actually. She's doing a premiere for my client on Friday, and she was apologizing profusely because I had followed up twice, hadn't heard from her, and we're pretty tight, and I was like I know this will be really good for you. And she was like I was just traveling for the past month and I came back to 7,000 emails. 7,000. So that just gives you an idea of a real life example of other people's challenges.

Kaytee Long:
So that's basically the process is following up via email. If you can follow up via socials, I think that's another thing it depends on the situation. You want to be really careful with the person. If they make it clear they're okay with pitches on social media because some people definitely are not, but even as a professional I don't get responses from everyone. And that's okay, that's just how it is. And that's actually the beauty of releasing singles, too, because when you release singles it gives you more ammo to reach out to the person, again, with new content. So if they didn't like the first one, if they didn't respond about the first one, whatever it is when you have a new song, a new music video, anything new, then that's a new reason to reach out to the person again and give it another shot.

Michael Walker:
Yeah. That totally makes sense that there's so much value in the follow up, because I mean it's like you were saying in terms of the pitch, it's like you're selling people on you. I've heard before, I don't know where they got this stat, but I've heard that most people need seven touch points before they actually purchase something online. So on it's on average seven new times of actually seeing something before they're like okay, I'm going to bite the bullet, I'm going to go with this thing. And so what you're saying with having multiple different songs to follow up with, and I think that there's something psychologically that happens where they just start to see your name, they start to see oh, this person's not going away and they're doing stuff. They're doing cool stuff.

Michael Walker:
And eventually one of those things cuts through. In terms of the follow up for us, what we usually do for the follow up sequence is we'll send out a message and if we don't hear back within a week or so, then we'll send out follow up number one. Follow up number one is basically just a reframe on the initial message. And the whole time is just focusing on them and what's valuable for them. And then the third one is the final follow up. If we don't hear back a week later, then we'll send one follow up message that's really short and sweet that's just hey, just wanted to follow up one last time here. I'm not sure if you had a chance to see this last one. If not, no worries at all, but I just wanted to follow up one last time. And man, there is something about that last follow up that really catches people, I think.

Kaytee Long:
Oh, you're telling me. Uh-huh (affirmative).

Michael Walker:
I think it's just the phrasing of last, like I'm just going to follow up one last time. I think a lot of times people they see an email or something and they're like yeah I'm going to get around to it at some point in the future. I'll get around to it. But then when it really comes crunch time they're like oh, this is the last one, then that's the one they'll take action on.

Kaytee Long:
100%. And that plays into also what is it 60,000 new songs are uploaded just to the DSPs every day. So if you're pitching someone two weeks out, which you do need to, that's part of the process to get that initial outreach out there, but because of editorial calendars, that's another topic, but people don't have time to really think about... I always tell people to stay away from pitching on Fridays if it's not releasing that day because someone doesn't have time or the head space to think about what's coming out the next week on Friday, but they're dealing with all the premieres and articles and such that they're doing for that day for releases that Friday.

Kaytee Long:
So definitely that's why the follow up I think can be really crucial, particularly in the music industry because there's so much volume and because once you approach the actual week of release, if the person had been thinking about covering you and they hadn't responded yet, then that's when you can really lock them down because they have the head space to be like oh, right. Okay. This is coming out on Friday. Great point.

Michael Walker:
That makes a lot of sense. Awesome. So one question that I'd be curious to hear your thoughts on are let's say that someone follows along with this and they do a really good job on their next release, and they a month out they start the reach out process and they secure some good press or publicity then what are your recommendations for what are some of the best ways to leverage a really good placement or really good article, and to really take it and run with it?

Kaytee Long:
So I don't even know if we covered the point of PR, but a lot for musicians, particularly when you're just starting out, a couple of the major reasons for doing a PR campaign is because it will get you social content and because it will help your SEO, your search engine optimization. So when someone Googles you, like in the industry for example, my client's gotten a publishing deal from this, because they see that you're busy, and you're working, and people are talking about you, which that's just human nature, right? When other people see that they're talking about you, that other people are talking about you, it's much more powerful than you talking about yourself. And it's coming from a different source, so there's more trust than if it's you talking about how great you are.

Kaytee Long:
So what you want to do is optimize that and make sure that everyone can see what's happening, too. So with a press placement, let's say you get a premiere in I don't know, [Mixdown 00:31:50], and the first thing you want to do is post it on social media. And you want to tag Mixdown, if the writer has an Instagram or you've created a relationship via Instagram, you can tag the writer. And just make sure that's on your profile and you're just shouting it to the world. And there's two reasons for that. It's because you want your fans to see and then also you want to give love to the writer, because again, with relationships you want to make sure that you're scratching their back as well. And what the writer is concerned about is getting clicks to the article, so you basically want to drive all traffic that day to your premiere, if that's what it is.

Kaytee Long:
Whatever the article is, you want to drive as much traffic as possible to it, and write them a little thank you note and thank them for... I mean, I guess you could write a handwritten thank you note, but I'm saying over email, however you've been communicating, just send them some gratitude for featuring you. And then, that'll increase your changes in the long run of being featured again if that opportunity comes up, and also just solidifies your relationship. Another thing I have put ad budgets behind press placements, like when I post it and throw a little ad money behind it, and then again, there's something really powerful about someone else talking about you as opposed to you talking about yourself, which is why PR is so powerful.

Michael Walker:
Awesome. Yeah. So sounds really like one of the main benefits of it just in terms of credibility and positioning having someone else saying these things about you has a much bigger impact than you just bragging about yourself basically. And in terms of what they're looking for really as a writer, they want to get as many clicks as possible and make sure that they're impacting as many people with it as possible, so really driving traffic to that is smart. I love the idea, too, of making sure to drop them a quick thank you note or just saying hey, I appreciate you. For the reasons that we talked about earlier, that's something that really sticks out with people I think. This is a random thing, but I think it's an amazing tool that anyone listening to this right now can get essentially for free, and it's really a powerful way to communicate with new people, especially if you're trying to build a relationship is loom.com, a free video screen share tool that you can basically click on and it will record a video of your screen and it'll record your webcam at the same time-

Kaytee Long:
That's how I filmed The Academy, actually, that's what I used.

Michael Walker:
Nice.

Kaytee Long:
It's amazing. I love it.

Michael Walker:
I love Loom. It's so cool and it's so great for communicating with people online, because what it does is one you can have that personal message, hey, thank you so much for this article. Look at this. Look at all these people that I've gotten messages from who said they loved it. You're awesome. You can show your screen and show these people.

Kaytee Long:
Oh, I love that. That's a great idea.

Michael Walker:
And then what it does, for anyone listening who hasn't used to before, it creates a link that you can actually copy and just drop it in an email. And one of the most powerful email subject lines and messages that I've sent to people is the subject line is video for you. Then the copy of the email is just hey, first name, recorded a quick video for you. And it's a one minute video, and it's a link to the Loom video, and then it's just you talking on the screen saying-

Kaytee Long:
Oh, I love that.

Michael Walker:
... you're awesome, thank you. And as long as you built somewhat of a relationship with them, I think it's just a great way to really connect on a much more personal level and a way to cut through the noise.

Kaytee Long:
Yeah. And that's a great point to the fact that people don't really like text, verbiage. That's going to be much more effective, sending a video and a quick little video for you, than writing paragraph after paragraph. Which I'm not saying do that for a media pitch, but what I am saying is don't write paragraph after paragraph. But I love that. People really gravitate towards visuals for sure. I bet you got a lot of good engagement on that.

Michael Walker:
Yeah. It's great. I use that all the time when I'm messaging team members or messaging other people. It's also really nice and simple. I'm just like hey, quick video for you. It took a minute. And sometimes when I'm writing emails I might overthink, I'll spend 15 minutes writing a three sentence email. So it's good. Cool. So Kaytee, we talked a little bit about you have this new course that's coming out, right? Could you talk a little bit about what you're working on right now, and for anyone here who's interested in taking this process, really having it streamlined and broken down with examples and whatnot, can you share a little bit about what you've created?

Kaytee Long:
Yeah. Absolutely. So it's actually version 2.0 of my DIY Music PR Bootcamp that launched years ago. And I just felt that the content needed to be updated because things have changed with the media landscape. And so it's called the DIY Music PR Academy, you can visit diymusicpracademy.com, and I'm the one teaching it and it's a video course, and I'll take you through the entire process of how to do a music PR campaign. And it has a ton of little tips and tricks that I use and that I teach my coaching clients and such. And then it also has templates and examples of pitches that have landed really great placements, and then I also link to the placements that its landed, so you can see the full story of how everything comes to fruition.

Kaytee Long:
And then also, press release examples, and we also cover Spotify, because that's a hot topic in the industry, obviously. And it can be considered part of the PR strategy, so I do provide how to do that, how it differs from a traditional PR pitch, and provide templates and examples of pitches for that as well. And then also, I have a fun little bonus in there that I added that's maybe you are wanting to work with a publicist, like hire someone to do your publicity, and so I included a little thing in there to help you decide if it's actually the right time for you and if it's a good place for you to be spending your money, because a lot of times I have artists come to me and they want publicity, but it's not the right point in their career for them to actually hire me.

Kaytee Long:
And I just wouldn't feel good about accepting their money when I know it's not the right point for them to do that. And so, this little checklist and tutorial that I do will help you decide if it's the right time, and then also gives you questions to ask of the potential people that you're interviewing to find out if it's a good fit, because it's also really important that you find the right person or the right firm that is a good fit for you, because not all firms are created equal and people have different specialties. And you might get along really well with someone and you might not.

Kaytee Long:
So definitely it's an important part of your strategy if you do decide to go that route. So lots of fun stuff. I mean, I literally just talk about everything that I know about PR because I just want to make it accessible to as many people as possible. That's the gist of it. I do have a freebee for you guys, though, if you're interested in learning how to do a pitch and what is actually included, what you would put in the pitch when you're writing to someone, I have a must have checklist for my Modern Musicians. And so you can go to diymusicpracademy.com/pitch and you can download it there.

Michael Walker:
That's awesome. That makes me so excited. I mean, it's such a cool time that we're living in where you have all these templates and really life examples, and literally a step by step walkthrough of how to do this, and it just saves so much time from starting from scratch.

Kaytee Long:
 So much time. I mean, honestly you could probably go Google this stuff, but it would take you hours. Like hours and hours. So I don't recommend it. And I've made the price also a lot more manageable for artists than I did the first time because the inspiration behind this is to get it to the masses, as opposed to people that don't feel comfortable spending a certain amount on a course. So my mission, I think why I'm here on this planet, is to help people be able to be creative. So that being said, I also have a discount code for you guys if you are interested in purchasing the DIY Music PR Academy, just use code MM25. So MM like Modern Musician, 25, and you'll get 25% off.

Michael Walker:
Wow. That is killer. Thank you so much for doing that. And also, thank you so much for, I mean regardless if you are ready to get the course or not, definitely go check out the freebie that she has. She has a checklist, that's incredible. Thank you so much for putting that together.

Kaytee Long:
Of course.

Michael Walker:
And I also would highly recommend if you're going to be implementing this and taking what you learned today and actually reaching out, then at a certain point you have to start looking at your time versus your money, and I think some of the smartest entrepreneurs, they value their time really high. Because time is a limited resource, it doesn't really come back unless... we'll see what happens with the future.  I mean, we'll live until we're 500 years old, then we'll have a whole set of new problems.

Kaytee Long:
 You're so right though. Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Michael Walker:
For the most part time doesn't replenish and if you can spend a little bit of money in order to save 10 to 20 hours, it's a really valuable investment. So I appreciate you taking all of the time and everything that you've invested, and not just time, but also the resources you've invested personally in order to acquire the knowledge that you have and be able to share that with as many people as possible. It's really cool. It's a really cool day in age that we live in, so thank you for being really a ray of light for people, I think.

Kaytee Long:
Aww, thank you, Michael. That means a lot. But any way that I can be of service I'm happy to and I hope to meet some of your audience as well, and help them in any way I can, and you can find me on Instagram @KayteeLongBecker and it's K-A-Y-T-E-E Long L-O-N-G Becker B-E-C-K-E-R.  So reach out to me, would love to chat and say hi.

Michael Walker:
Cool. Yeah. And what we'll do, too, is we'll put all the links in the show notes so if you're listening to this right now if you click on the description, you should be able to see all the different links for the freebies, and for the course, and for the socials and stuff. So I would highly recommend checking it out, and Kaytee, thanks again for taking the time to be here today.

Kaytee Long:
Yeah. Thank you so much, Michael. It's been a pleasure.

Michael Walker:
Hey, it's Michael here. I hope that you got a ton of value out of this episode. Make sure to check out the show notes to learn more about our guest today, and if you want to support the podcast then there's a few ways to help us grow. First, if you hit subscribe then that'll make sure you don't miss a new episode. Secondly, if you share it with your friends on your social media, tag us. That really helps us out. And third, best of all, if you leave us an honest review it's going to help us reach more musicians like you who want to take their music careers to the next level. The time to be a Modern Musician is now, and I look forward to seeing you on our next episode.