Eli Lev: And just to maybe speak to some perceived objections already from musicians who are like: Hey, I'm not an indie-folk singer/songwriter. That's fine. Like, they like your music, whatever your music is. So if you are an instrumental flute player, you can create a piece inspired by that story with them on the call. If you are a technical death metal band, they love your music, they love technical death metal, so make a custom song where you're literally screaming these awesome lyrics; [both laughing] singing these awesome lyrics about their person. Like what an amazing gift. So whatever music you do, you can turn that into a gift for someone. Cause I know it's like: Oh, that's easy. You know, you got a guitar and you can sing, but anything; any vibration can mean a lot to somebody. And that's why they like your music in the first place. So I would perceive that some artists are out there are like: well, that's like not my genre, but any genre this will work for. 

Michael Walker: It's easy to get lost in today's music industry with constantly changing technology and where anyone with a computer can release their own music. I'm going to share with you why this is the best time to be an independent musician and it's only getting better. If you have high-quality music, but you just don't know the best way to promote yourself so that you can reach the right people and generate a sustainable income with your music, we're going to show you the best strategies that we're using right now to reach millions of new listeners every month without spending 10 hours a day on social media. We're creating a revolution in today's music industry and this is your invitation to join me. I'm your host, Michael Walker.

What's going on, everyone? Welcome back to another episode of the Modern Musician Live Podcast. I'm super excited to be here today with my good friend and business partner, Eli Lev. Eli is someone that I feel like really represents the ethos of Modern Musician in so many different ways. You're someone that leads by example, you walk the walk. We've played a show together here in Orlando at the local Clean Eats and someone that has a lot of experience with starting a music career from scratch. I remember when we first connected about, gosh, like coming up on six years or so ago, when I first started Modern Musician you were in a pretty different place of your life and now you're here and you're sharing your music with the world in such a beautiful way. So it's been really an honor to watch your journey and I'm excited to have you on the podcast today to share a few of the things that you're doing right now in particular that are working really well to be able to connect with your fans. So Eli, thank-you so much for taking the time to come on here.

Eli Lev: Yeah, this is awesome. My favorite thing to do is to chat with you, Michael, because I always get ideas from you and it's a great exchange. I'm happy to share what I am currently up to in the Eli Lev music world. So I'm excited. [plays dun dun duuuunnn soundfx]

Michael: [both laughing] Oh man, I think that's the first time I've ever been able to use that and actually nailed the perfect moment for it. Fantastic. Well, hey Eli, I think a lot of folks who are here who are part of our community, they've connected with you since you're really at the heart of what we're doing here at Modern Musician. But for anyone who hasn't met you yet, or they haven't heard your backstory, I'd love for you to share a little bit about yourself and how you got started at Modern Musician those 6 years ago.

Eli: Yeah, sure. In a nutshell, I began my professional career as a middle school teacher. I taught 8th grade on the Navajo Indian Reservation in Northern Arizona out of a university. I stayed there for three years, and that's where the inspiration for my Four Directions project came from. Traveled the world after that: Australia, New Zealand, I lived in Israel, a small country called Andorra in Europe. I came back to get my master's degree in education and I did, and I was going to be a teacher's teacher, and then music had other plans for my life. I like to say that music kind of found me. You know, they say it's kinda like a calling. At this point, it's just totally taken over my life in a very good way: I found a way to serve others, I found a way to connect with an incredible fan base and community, and I found a way to express myself as a person, and music is really the means for that. I've been a full-time musician for the last… I would say, yeah, 6 or 7 years. We met right at the beginning of Eli Lev, and now I am touring the USA, touring the world, mailing list, texting list, creating experiences for my fans, opportunities for them to connect with. My community is called “the Levitators”. Eli Lev: we levitate. That's cheesy. It's been a wonderful journey and I connected with you, Michael, and Modern Musician probably in the first year and a half that I was going full-time and it was really just like rocket fuel to what I was doing as a musician. I learned a lot about how to connect with my people, how to foster those relationships, and how to earn a living off of those connections. So here I am 6/7 years later just was named one of the top 100 touring artists in the world from BandsInTown last year, and lots more amazing things to come this year.

Michael: Yeah, that's so awesome. You know, I will never forget the feeling that I had on our first session. Some of the exact details, our brains are not great at remembering these specificities and facts, but I do remember the feel. I remember the vibe. I remember being on that session. Every once in a while, I connect with someone here who is just…. like my Spidey sense is just like [makes vibration noise] and I remember meeting you and just having that sense of like: dang, this guy's on another level.

Eli: Thanks!

Michael: So it's been really interesting seeing where things are at now, it's helped me to sort of trust that intuition more when I have that Spidey sense. I would love to zoom back because you mentioned that recently, you actually went back and watched our first session that we did and I would love to go back and watch it too, because it would probably just be funny to watch it. But the fact that we have that recording. If you're listening to this right now, imagine that you had this specific moment that you connected with someone who changed your life. Maybe it's your significant other or a partner, and you could actually go back in time and you have documented the specific experience and moment of the whole thing. [both laughing] It's pretty cool. The fact that we live our lives on zoom, in some ways, is amazing that we have that level of documentation. In particular, I would love to hear from you cause I remember you mentioned that it made you chuckle because you remember, back then, coming in, you're really skeptical or like: okay, like who is this guy and what is this Modern Musician stuff, and you're sussing it out. It's funny now cause on the other side, we've built trust and a relationship and you can really see the heart of what we're doing here. I think that there's a lot of folks who maybe they're on the outside or maybe they haven't joined Modern Musician as a community, and they might have a similar sort of question mark. For good reason. Maybe they've been burned in the past or maybe they just haven't built the level of trust yet. I'm curious to hear from your perspective, coming into it, what was that sense of hesitancy or skepticism, and what was your experience on the other side?

Eli: Yeah, and I remember very vividly coming into the music industry and just being like: Oh no, here we go. Cause musicians, like let's be honest, we want it! We want it so bad, so it kind of makes us easy targets for some things because if somebody promises something and it's like: okay, yeah, that's exactly what I want. And so I was very careful about that in the beginning. I had some bad experiences with producers who kind of led me astray. I had a bad experience online with something that was just like: aww man! But I knew that I had to find the right people and I knew that I did have to rely on my spidey senses, and go with my gut and my intuition. Eventually, because you can't get anywhere alone in music or any industry. So I started doing research; very careful research and getting on calls with people and I met an awesome vocal coach, I met a great PR agent, I met an incredible web designer. So it's like: okay, I'm getting the hang of this and then you were within that same kind of group where it's like: okay, I think I'm finding the right people, but I'm still a little bit skeptical. We talked for like an hour, you know what I mean? You asked a lot about my music and had a lot of great ideas that I hadn't heard of before, or ideas that I'd heard of, but not the way that you were presenting them. And I am a sucker for things that work. [laughing] I don't know. I don't think I'm the only one out there.

Michael: It's a good bias to have. That's one of those biases that like, it's good to have a bias for things that actually work.

Eli: Yeah. I have a bias for things that work and are effective and are just a system that I can kind of plug into. So that's what really attracted me about the Modern Musician system. It was like a clear step-by-step path on how to get fans, how to build those relationships, and how to monetize that so you can keep doing that and building the fan base. So that was really interesting to me. Plus there's like a spiritual element that's very important to me. There's a lot of folks out there who might hit different triggers in people. Maybe a trigger is like: you're the best at what you do and I can make you the best, cause that's the main goal. And I didn't really resonate with that. There's a lot of others out there like: I can just get you tons of listeners and tons of fans cause that's all that matters. And it's like, I'm not really sure. But you yourself and the Modern Musician approach is very holistic. It's about actually me becoming a better person in order to become a better artist and a better community leader. And that really resonated with me because, not only can I build my music career, and I can work on myself as a professional and as a person. So I think all those things together were like: okay, the system, I connect with the message here, and it's an investment, but I know that music is a business. It absolutely is a business, and like any business we need to invest in ourselves. And it was an investment in myself too. So I love that and went for the leap and that investment has paid off 50-100 fold since then in many ways. So I'm very glad I went for it and here we are!

Michael: That's just so awesome. Yeah. Thanks for sharing that. It's really humbling, I think, to have this ability to be able to go back in time and sorta juxtapose the before and the after. I think what you just shared, at least for me, gives people a little bit of a portal into their future selves. I think for a lot of people they might be early on, or they might be kind of at that point that you were at and sort of like looking at this portal and they're trying to figure out and find the right people. They're trying to find the people that are their people and so it's really helpful to be able to have conversations like this and kind of be able to give people a portal into future versions of themselves. So speaking of giving people a portal into cool possibilities and visions, one thing in particular that I was excited about connecting with you on today was about this opportunity around creating custom songs for your fans and ultimately about, I think the way that you described it is about creating like a gift and serving your fans, providing value and kind of the impact that you've seen by doing this. So I'd love to hear just a quick overview of what that's all about in terms of custom songs, what you've been doing, and sort of the impact that you've seen it make on your own career and on the lives of your fans.

Eli: Yeah, I love that because I just finished up kind of like a huge cycle of custom songs for the holiday season, so I can kind of relate as to what my current method is. I've experimented with a lot of different ways to do custom songs. What I have come to realize is that people who are interested in custom songs are less interested in the production value and the bells and whistles and the multi tracks, and they're more interested in me performing a song that we wrote together live with just a guitar and me singing over it. And what that does is it actually allows me to write more of them, takes less time to write, but there's much more of a sense of ownership from the person who's requesting them. Because how the process works is I send out, we call this a shot across the bow, right? An email or a message that says: Hey, have you ever thought about giving the gift of song to someone you love? I always like to try and make these very conversational. My emails are not newsletters. They're just words like a friend would be writing. So I start with just a very simple sentence or two. And then whoever responds to that, replies by email, I have another email that I sent to them which is like: Hey, that's awesome, I would love that and I'm so glad that you're interested in it too. I've created a form for you to fill out to see if it's a good fit. You can do this with GoogleForms or TypeForms, or I use StreetTeam for my forms as well. And the form pretty much goes through a very basic process of: what's your name? What's your email? Who would you like this song to be for? What's the occasion? And any details that they have about the other person that they'd like to include. And then I set a budget benchmark for them. I usually charge X amount for these songs, does that sound doable to you? And kind of leave it open a little bit that way. That way I am anchoring the price to make sure that it's worthwhile, but that they also know what an amazing investment and the true value of something like this really is. So that value has gone up every year for the last 3 or 4 years as my community has grown and as my time and value as a creative has grown as well. Once they fill out the form, essentially I score them and put like the most qualified at the top, and like the least qualified where maybe they just put one word or like: no, that doesn't work for me at the bottom. And then I start reaching out one by one after the forms were filled and say: Hey, I think this is a great fit. Here's where you can schedule a call with me. I also use StreetTeam for my calendar and appointments. On StreetTeam it's pretty cool.... this is the software that Modern Musician uses, that we use at Modern Musician, in the appointment, you can actually set a price and it goes straight to stripe. So to set an appointment, there's a certain amount to put down a deposit to make sure that we're good to go during that day. I set up a couple of automations like saying: Hey, our appointment is coming up. And what happens, Michael, is that on that hour that we set, we write most of the entire song together. It's pretty cool. So I'm not spending 3 or 4 hours after the call writing the song. I’m really kind of optimizing my time. How that call usually looks is: Hey, this is fantastic. I'm so excited. Thanks for trusting me with this, cause it's a personal thing. Then I ask about their history. And then I ask about how that person makes them feel, and anything else that they like to include in the song. And with those kinda four sections we just start vamping. I say: Hey, does this feel good to you? Does this rock? And by the end of the hour, we have probably about half, three quarters, maybe even the entire song complete. And I started asking people: how would you like this song? Would you like it as an MP3 or a live performance video unlisted on YouTube and 80% asked for the live performance version of the song on YouTube. So I practiced the song maybe once and then turn on the camera on my computer, record the song all the way through and post it as an unlisted YouTube link they can use to share with their loved one or friends and family, and it's very easy to access.

Michael: Dang, dude, that is awesome. Thank-you for kind of breaking down the whole system for us. [sarcastically] If only there's a way in StreetTeam to do that all that stuff that you just walked through, if you could just turn it into a template, and I don't know, just add it to people's accounts and like a click. [Eli laughing] Man, that would be pretty awesome.

Eli: That'd be great. [both laughing]

Michael: So is it currently templatized? Is it currently in our StreetTeam templates for artists? If not, is that something that we can maybe put together as a bonus for people? I would say that's actually a great one in particular for gold artists. When we talk about a diamond offer, that to me feels like that's a diamond offer for a fan.

Eli: Oh yeah!

Michael: I think that, in particular, would be most relevant to gold artists who you are looking to create diamond offers. Maybe we could add that to the template.

Eli: Yeah. I love that. And what I usually do is I do these around the holiday times, cause that's when people are looking for gifts, that's when I'm kind of taking a break from touring anyways. So it's really like my entire income for the end of November and December comes from custom songs, and really allows me to kind of weather the winter in a sense. Then in January I'm doing other diamond offers like a songwriting retreat. So my winters are for like my big offers like that when I have the time to invest. That might be a different time for different artists, but looking at my year, planning the time when to offer this is great. So whether it's once or twice or maybe once every quarter but it's good to do a little push around them. So yeah, I have got the email copy. I've got the appointment calendar template. I've got the survey as well. So those are all there.

Michael: So cool. I mean, one thing that comes to mind too is just the whole concept of the inner circle that artists are creating. We could probably do something where if someone gets a custom song that's a diamond offer and maybe it comes bundled in with a full year of the diamond level of your inner circle.

Eli: Oooo that's really cool because so much deep connection comes from that songwriting session. I can see people's little profile photos on my live streams that I do every week or like we can text or email back and forth, but spending an hour with someone and getting to know their personality and them sharing what they love about someone they love? I mean, we have a lifetime connection now. I know every single person personally that I worked with for a custom song. So as a diamond level, it's like: Hey, enter into my top level inner circle. And you just get a free custom song once a year, essentially. That'd be amazing. I think it's really smart.

Michael: Yeah. Let's definitely set that up for you. I think that's a great idea. I mean, it might even make sense for that just to be like the default diamond offer. Obviously people can be creative and you can do different types of diamond offers. We've seen some artists having amazing results with the fan retreats. But I love this idea sort of like the default diamond offer for an artist, because the inner circle is just all about access and about connecting in a more intimate way with the artist, and what more intimate way to connect with your favorite artist than being present with them and being able to create a song together? Really cool.

Eli: And just to maybe speak to some perceived objections already from musicians who are like: Hey, I'm not an indie-folk singer/songwriter. That's fine. They like your music, whatever your music is. So if you are an instrumental flute player, you can create a piece inspired by that story with them on the call. If you are a technical death metal band, they love your music, they love technical death metal, so make a custom song where you're literally screaming these awesome lyrics; [both laughing] singing these awesome lyrics about their person. Like what an amazing gift. So whatever music you do, you can turn that into a gift for someone. Cause I know it's like: Oh, that's easy. You know, you got a guitar and you can sing, but anything/any vibration can mean a lot to somebody. And that's why they like your music in the first place. So I perceive that some artists out there are like: well, that's like not my genre, but any genre this will work for.

Michael: Awesome. I love it. I mean, the fact is if someone is a super fan of your music, it's because of the fact they love your mind and they love your music. They love who you are.

Eli: Exactly.

Michael: And so this is about them connecting with you and probably the deepest way you could connect with an artist, which is like co-creating something together.

Eli: Exactly!

Michael: I also love the idea for all those people that got the diamond song from you, being like: Hey, by the way, I wanted to give you special recognition, and so I want to make you in the diamond here of my inner circle. And then there's some cool status and recognition that they sort of get from that in your inner circle community, when they're talking to each other, people can see that.

Eli: Yeah! And you're also seeding that community with the people you've connected with most and who have raised their hand and were like: I want to support you too. So yeah, that's a super smart idea just automatically being like: Hey. You know, I wrote 10 custom songs this last holiday. All of you, congratulations, you get a year of essentially this tier. And so anybody else who comes into that environment can feel that, you know what I mean? It's like: Oh, wow. You can't wait till Eli gets to write you your custom song in the holidays. It's amazing! So, that's smart.

Michael: Cool. Yeah. I know we have a few team members who are here right now and we're just getting ready to do our live cohort rollout of the program. So for anyone that isn't aware of this. If you're either currently an active member of our Gold Artist Academy, or you are someone that just joined, you're kind of getting ready to go through it, we're about to go through the whole program as a team and with a cohort of our clients, and we're going to basically make a big list of all of the improvements and updates and things that we want to change in the program. Where my mind is going with this right now Eli is like: this is a great opportunity to actually build this framework into the core program.

Eli: Cool.

Michael: For the templates and to also integrate it with the inner circle for the diamond level of the inner circle. So let's make it happen.

Eli: Awesome. Stoked. Let's do it. I mean, it's all about bringing value, not only to artists but to our fans. The more value we can bring into their lives, that's what we're here for, and this is one of the highest value expressions that I've been able to experience as an artist, besides live shows and in-person retreats. This is up there with the top 3.

Michael: Cool. Yeah. I would love to hear you go a little bit deeper on that too. I remember when Paradise Fears, when we did the house concerts and we connected in-person with people and performed for them and their friends and their family, that level of intimacy was extremely valuable and extremely powerful in terms of building that relationship, and those people became our lifelong fans who would fly across the country to come see us play and got tattoos. It was a really powerful thing that we could offer that was so valuable to them. I'm imagining, cause I personally haven't really done this myself, but from what I've heard from you and from other artists who've been doing these custom songs is that impact that you're making is a similar kind of thing. So I would love to hear your perspective in terms of having that experience and what kind of impact that has really made.

Eli: Yeah. I mean, interestingly enough, half of the folks who got the custom songs I met at house shows.

Michael: Ah, there you go. [both laughing]

Eli: So that being like, Oh, I've met this person. I know this person. There's a trust there, you know?

Michael: Yeah.

Eli: That was, I think, really important to that. I mean, not so important, not the only thing, but it definitely was like a huge factor in that.

Michael: Yeah, I think that there's a good contender for the diamond offer as well is the house concert.

Eli: Yeah, and that can definitely lead into the custom songs as well. And that can lead into retreats. That's like a whole kind of personalized circle that are definitely all up there.

Michael: Just vibing here, but what if when people joined the diamond level of your inner circle, they got to choose one thing per year. It's like: they get to choose: I want a house concert this year, or I want to do a custom song this year. If you had like 3 options for them and they could basically rotate between them, it might be a cool thing for people to stay in your diamond inner circle for years and years.

Eli: I love that. And we can even do just like a poll or like: Hey, this year, everybody in the diamond, what are you most interested in a custom song or a retreat, or a private show for you? And just source it that way. That might also be interesting. I wanted to read some of the testimonials that I gathered. A week after I delivered the song, I did a follow up email where I asked: Hey, can you just do a quick testimonial? Cause these are going to be amazing for the next round; the feedback.

Michael: So smart.

Eli: So I wanted to share just a few: The song captured the story I wanted to tell and the memories I wanted to share perfectly! My parents love the song and will treasure this gift for a lifetime. That's the kind of power that these can have. Here's another one: This was for her mother's 100th birthday.

Michael: Ha! Wow.

Eli: The result was a video of Eli singing directly to my mom, expressing love and gratitude from her 5 children, 14 grandchildren, and 7 great grandchildren. We played the video on a big screen at my mom's birthday party, and there was not a dry eye in the house when the song ended. I'm so grateful that Eli offers his gifts for special occasions and produces music with love and laughs.

Michael: Dang, dude. I'm getting emotional just thinking about that experience for them with their hundred year old grandmother, the whole family coming together, that was such a special moment for them.

Eli: Yeah. And I got feedback and she was like: my mom said “I'm responsible for all this, aren't I?” She says “yes, you are, and we all love you”. And it was after that song that she said that to her and had that moment. And I was just like: this is why. This is the why for all this that makes me feel so good as an artist and a human being. So this connects with something that can travel through generations, entire lifetimes, which is beautiful.

Michael: Dang. That's very cool. Thanks for sharing that. And I mean, so super smart for you to ask! Something we forget sometimes: when you give your fans something, especially when they purchase something from you and you give it to them and they're really grateful and excited about getting the thing, it's really smart to ask for a testimonial or just to ask them to share their experience.

Eli: Yeah, and those will go in next year’s emails. Like: here's some of the feedback that I got from last year's participants. It can go on your landing page for a funnel if you're building that, and it can go just in my daily good vibes check-in, you know what I mean? Putting some of those and just reminding myself of: the hard work pays off and people really appreciate it.

Michael: That's a great one. Yeah. One to throw in your vision tank right there, and every morning you just go through and remember your “why” and your purpose and the impact that you're making. That is so awesome.

Eli: Yeah

Michael: Well, hey, we've got a live audience that are here right now who are a part of this as well. I'd love to open up the floor to anyone that has any feedback or questions or thoughts that you'd like to connect with Eli here.

All right. So I see Voz requested to speak. So Voz, let's bring you on here live. Hey Voz! How are you doing today?

Voz: Doing great. Hello, Levi.

Eli: Howdy, Voz, how are you?

Voz: Man, life is good and it even gets better listening to the joy you're bringing. I mean, wow!

Eli: Thank-you.

Voz: I mean, a 100-year-old grandma story.

Eli: Yeah.

Voz, It's great. Once again, I want to be brief because I'm sure lots of people want to ask questions. But I did put in the chat a list of questions, the structure, how you go about your recording process.

Eli: Sure.

Voz: Cause I have people ask me about… they have poetry and I've done this in the past just to use their lyrics and put some chords to it.

Eli: Yeah.

Voz: So anyways, that's kind of the thing: is there an average length and you can see it in there.

Michael: Cool. Thank-you. Thank-you, Voz. He’s got a list here of questions all related to the custom song experience

Eli: Great!

Michael: I'll just go ahead and I'll read these for Voz. So the first one you asked was, a few different questions about the overall song itself that you kind of come up with like what’s the average length of the song is, is there a standard aaba structure? I think he's wondering: is it like a normal song with a verse-chorus-bridge? What kind of happens with these songs? What does it look like?

Eli: Yeah, a great question. They can be anywhere from 2 minutes to 4 - 4.5 minutes, depending on how much information is there from the person who's wanting to give. A lot of them are around the 3 minute range, just like a regular, average song. If I feel like I didn't get that much information, I might add a second chorus. [laughing] If I feel like I got too much information, then I would just say: Hey, let's focus on the ones that you absolutely want to make sure that are in the song, and I'll do that all on the zoom call. So I would say anywhere from 2.5-3.5, maybe 4 minutes for each song. There are a lot of specific situations that come up. You can definitely translate a poem for someone. I have made music for someone's video holiday letter where I followed along on the screen and was just saying what was happening. So there's a lot of different ways that people can… I actually did a cover song for someone. They're like: you know what, I don't want to do the whole thing, it just seems like a lot. Can you just say: happy birthday to my wife and sing this cover song? I'm like, sure! So that can all happen. I think being flexible is very smart.

Michael: Awesome. Yeah. I mean, one of the things that really struck me about your experience, Eli, is how one of your realizations was that people, what they really value the most and the reason that they're doing the custom song isn't necessarily that they care that much about the specifics of how many tracks there are, being a full production, like X, Y, Z. Really it's about the heart of the experience with them kind of creating the music together with one of their favorite artists, and you doing the live performance of it. I bet that's just a huge relief because it's just a lot less time and energy and effort and it's more raw and authentic.

Eli: Yeah.

Michael: Pretty cool.

Eli: I started doing 2, 3, 4, 5 track productions for these, and I would spend hours doing the drums and the harmonies and the lead and people liked them, but the intimacy and the personal nature of the song actually came out more when it was stripped down and acoustic and it was highlighting the vocals. So I'm saving myself 4-5, maybe even 6 hours of post-production on these and just the imperfectness of singing a song for the second or third time, that's actually where the magic happens because just as you're feeling the song, the emotions coming out and you're not doing it for the third or fourth take, it's all there. People are really just appreciative of that.

Another thing that I wanted to mention is that the simpler and more direct the lyrics are, the better. So what I found is just a stream of consciousness of me singing whatever comes to mind based on the information of their relationship, based on how they feel about the other person, is even more powerful than spending an hour on making the “perfect line”. And it's actually helped my songwriting. For me, improved drastically because it's making my lyrics simple, more direct and understandable. Digestible almost. So it's really actually affecting my production as a songwriter too. I wrote 10 songs in a month, you know what I mean, for other people. But it was still a practice to get into. So that's also pretty helpful.

Michael: That's super cool. I can imagine that'd be a really powerful way to sorta flex the songwriting muscle and to learn how to use as a creative prompt for writing new songs. Awesome.

Let's bring it home. I mean, this is one of my favorite questions. I love to ask this question regularly because there's always a good perspective that comes out of it. Eli, if you could kind of go back in time to yourself, back when you were just getting started with your music and maybe you were just on the fence where you were about to take the plunge and go all in, maybe it was right around that time when you discussed you were finding your people and you started to connect with people in the industry. If you could give yourself one piece of advice, what would it be?

Eli: I think it would be probably not to think about music as like a Led Zeppelin/Nirvana/Adele/Taylor Swift success story and get wrapped up in “the product” that we're sold as artists, and think of it as a way to connect with people. Anytime that I was a musician, whether I was going into the studio and thought about: Hey, these songs are just a way for me to connect with somebody through their ears, or maybe I was about to be on stage and I was like: Hey, this is just a way for you to connect with human beings in the same room that you're going to be with, or whether I was writing custom songs where it's like: the song is kinda important, but what's really important here is the connection that you're forging with these people and that you're helping them forge with their friends and family and loved ones. Bringing it down to that human level of interaction has been probably the biggest breakthrough I've had as an artist. And now I see my music, my songs, and my brand, my persona not as like the end in itself, but as a means to connect and give service to the world. Once I made that switch, things started happening: People started smiling more; I got more fans; I got more listeners; People started complimenting my songs. Not because of anything else, but just the heart and authenticity that went into it. People notice those things. I notice those things as a listener. So if I gave any advice to myself, it would be: think of this as you're in the people business, and music is the way to connect with them.

Michael: Just so, so good. Well, let's give a virtual round of applause to Eli Lev. Yeeeaaaah. Again, stay in tune on your email for next steps related to the live cohort that we're doing and going through. I'm looking forward to connecting with you personally through that, if you're a part of it, and we're going to be building these systems and templates into the software tool for you so that you can just a single click get these set up for yourself. So thank-you, Eli, for being you and sharing some of the insights and lessons that you've learned. That felt just so, I mean, authentic is definitely the right word and sort of just like remembering what's important and what's not. I try to come back to that exercise a lot where you imagine that you're on your deathbed and you're looking back at your life and you're about to say goodbye to everyone and everything that you knew. It seems like in those moments that's when we get the most clarity and you can realize really what's important and what's not, and it's the connections. Yeah. It's the people. It's the relationships that we build that are so important. So yeah, it's a good reminder. So thank-you for that.

Eli: I'm grateful for you, Michael. Thank-you for giving me the courage and the belief in myself that I had what it takes to do the thing. And every step of the way I've been learning from you too, and I definitely feel honored to be in your circle. You're one of those connections that means a lot to me too. So thank-you.

Michael: Thanks, man.

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