Erica Mason: Emotional content, stuff that makes you laugh, makes you feel good. It makes you sometimes cry. These are the ones that people are resonating with the most. 

 Your music is a universal language that speaks to a person's soul, your mind, your emotions. And so how can your music highlight that to get them to do a specific action?

Michael Walker:  It's easy to get lost in today's music industry with constantly changing technology and where anyone with a computer can release their own music. I'm going to share with you why this is the best time to be an independent musician and it's only getting better. If you have high-quality music, but you just don't know the best way to promote yourself so that you can reach the right people and generate a sustainable income with your music, we're going to show you the best strategies that we're using right now to reach millions of new listeners every month without spending 10 hours a day on social media. We're creating a revolution in today's music industry and this is your invitation to join me. I'm your host, Michael Walker.

All right. So I'm super excited to be here today with Erica Mason. So Erica is an international recording artist who has made her mark with her soulful voice and steadfast dedication to inspiring hearts.

She has grown from scratch with her music career to gaining over 2 million social media followers. She charted at number one on iTunes and Amazon music. She's also performed at the stellar awards. And one thing that I really appreciate about Erica is how much she really attaches the message of helping and inspiring her community with her music and specifically focusing on, things like empowerment and mental health advocacy and healing. And, in terms of what's needed right now in the world, more than anything, I think, healing is such a huge part of that.

So Erica, I so appreciate what you're doing with your music and I'd really admire the amount of energy that you've put into it and what you've built and connecting with you at our retreat in LA. It was also super, super cool. So thank you for for coming on here and taking the time to connect with everyone here who's live today. 

Erica Mason: Of course I'm super happy to be here. I'm excited. Thanks for having me. 

Michael Walker: Of course. So to kick things off, maybe for everyone here who this is their first time connecting with you or hearing about you, could you just do a quick introduction and share a little bit about your journey and your story of how you got started and made it to this point that you're at now with millions of followers.

Erica Mason: Yeah hi everybody. Like I said, my name is Erica. A long story of trial and error in this music space. Funny thing is I never actually wanted to do music or be a rapper. It was just one of those gifts that I didn't realize that I had. When I was in school, I was doing like the, they beat on the table and I'm freestyling and I actually was really good at it, right?

And so my cousin, he bought Fruity Loops and he was just making beats all the time. And so then he would be like, Oh, Erica, just come in here and like freestyle something. And so I would freestyle and we actually would just make songs. So that was like my first introduction to making music through my cousin.

So I definitely have him to thank for starting me in my career. But then as I began to get older, I was doing shows in high school and stuff like that, but nothing really serious, just perfecting my craft, and I liked it because it was just a way for me to express myself. But I really started to take my career serious when I graduated college.

And I was, I remember graduating and everyone was like, yeah, I'm going to either get my master's or I'm going to do law. And they're like, Erica, what are you going to do? And I'm like, I guess I'm going to be a rapper. So it was this thing that I wasn't sure how I was going to do it, but I knew that maybe this was the route that I wanted to take.

And so it took me a long time to figure out my sound. It took me a long time to figure out like who my people were. And so there was a lot of trial and error. And so the real journey began when I started taking it serious. It's like writing a song a day and just getting those reps in to make better music.

And then as I began to make better music, I started studying social media and trying to figure out how to navigate that space. And one thing that I realized is like me being able to be vulnerable in my music, just personally, helps me to create better. It just makes me feel better. And so I started implementing that into the music, but then posting about it.

And as I began to post about it that's where I started to go viral because I was talking about really heavy topics, mental health stuff depression, anxiety, suicide, and those things. And it was a very like bold, angle to take, but for me, it was less about trying to impress people and more so about navigating my own healing journey and using music as the art that was like healing me.

And so I started going viral on social media and that was like the game changer and I was like, man, I've been doing this for a long time. Just like music, but social media came in and really flipped everything on its head. So as I started to go viral, I started to find my people and pay attention to what it was that was resonating with them.

And so then taking that feedback, I started perfecting my craft and then that opened the door for me to be able to be on BET and then also to be able to go number one on iTunes. And I started dropping music, but all of it has been a community effort. Like I always say. My supporters and my fans, I wouldn't be here without them honestly.

My music just wouldn't be where it is without them. And my biggest thing has been just figuring out ways to create experiences for my listeners through being raw and transparent, but then also creating cool ways for them to feel connected to, to what we're building through music.

And yeah I've had different opportunities where I've been able to sign, and I was able to sign a deal that was, like, really beneficial for me. And now I'm independent again, so I'm one of those people where it's just give me the deals and get the money so I can stay independent. And it was a great opportunity because I learned a lot behind the scenes.

And so now I'm back fully independent and now I'm learning how to build a business side. I like how the label's running and yeah, it's just been a really fun experience of figuring out who I am, figuring out how I best operate, and then figuring out how to run a business to make those things flourish.

Michael Walker: So cool. Yeah, thank you for sharing that. 

Erica Mason: Absolutely. 

Michael Walker: One thing that I so appreciate about you, Erika and it's just, the bottom line is that to accomplish anything, meaningful or worthwhile to make it It requires, significant amounts of dedication and passion and perseverance and belief in what you're doing.

And it's one thing for where you're at now, right? Like you have the proof, right? Like you have the social proof, you have the outcome. But I think a lot of people are here right now for watching this, you know might resonate with where you were at the beginning, right? Because at the beginning before you had It's like imagine dragons described like the lightning and the thunder right before you have the thunder i'm curious like at that beginning stage, what were some of the biggest challenges that you're going through or 

I'd love to hear where your journey started and what were some of the biggest challenges at that point that you think that maybe people here who are in the audience who are starting out might need to hear? 

Erica Mason: I would say so I think for so long I was waiting on someone to save me in a sense or do it for me.

And so what that looked like is when I was younger, like I had opportunities to get signed, but I was dropped from the opportunity. Don't really know why to this day. As a teenager, you get your hopes up and thinking like, Oh man, I got that validation from like industry executives who actually see value in what I'm doing or potential.

And then for that to get ripped underneath your feet is very disheartening, especially at that age, right? Not really knowing and understanding really how the music industry works. And so experiencing a lot of no's definitely before I experienced a lot of yeses. Like now I'm on the side where I'm experiencing probably more yeses than I've ever had in my life, right?

But I had to hit a lot of no's. People telling me that there's not a space for you. Executives saying, man, you're really talented, but I don't know what to do with you. I don't feel like I'm able to market you or we don't really have a place for you here. And so for me, that felt very lonely because I wasn't doing the stuff that everybody else in the mainstream market was doing.

So I definitely have very niche music. And so not necessarily knowing where I fit in was oftentimes discouraging because what took me the longest was figuring out how to find my, like, where are the people who, think like I think, or maybe feel like how I feel and how do I find them? And so that's, that was like years of just trying to put myself in because I'm in the technically like hip hop space, but I'm also in this like conscious music healing therapy. It's. It's still ambiguous as far as a genre and what you can put me in, but I would find myself in like really aggressive like hip hop spaces that I, it just wasn't my thing and I would show up and I would perform but oftentimes still feel like, man, I don't really know where I belong.

And so I wrestled with that a lot and thinking maybe this isn't where I'm supposed to be. And then everything in me was like, no, like your art, this is your music. Like people want to hear this. They need to hear this, but you just have to find the right people. And so I dealt with a lot of discouragement on that because at one point I didn't have a hundred thousand monthly listeners.

I think I had 5, 000 monthly listeners or something like that. And before TikTok existed, I had zero TikTok followers. And then on Instagram, I remember when I had 5, 000. And so it was one of those things where I had to really remove the focus off of the numbers and figure out how to so I guess detach myself from the end result and really fall in love with the journey of figuring out who I am and figuring out where those people are.

But yeah, I definitely faced a lot of those people. scamming me and people like, you know what I'm saying? Just music industry stuff. And we can get into the specifics if they have questions about that. But yeah, for a long time, I just didn't feel like I had a place. And then my music, like I struggled finding producers struggled finding people who were able to help me to curate my sound because I don't produce, I don't play an instrument.

So I'm always like. Really appreciative of people who do and you guys are artists as well. Just because it's a great skill set to have But like finding those people who believe in you I stopped looking for people to like my family to believe in me and I started to understand that maybe my family won't be the place to start like they're not my fans my family and friends are not my fans, right?

So I had to understand that and I used to feel like upset or get bothered when people didn't support me or, and things like that. And now I'm, I've learned to understand like it's just a matter of finding your people. And that was through trial and error and being able to use social media as a platform to be able to help me really was like a solution for me.

Michael Walker: So good. Yeah, there's so many valuable lessons in there about, really about like self validation and about connecting with your people as opposed to, What you mentioned , it's not always the people that we'd like to support us and, friends, family, partners the people are there.

So I'm curious how... One of the things that I feel like I've seen as a pattern that really separates people who are able to accomplish amazing things like yourself and people who just give up too early is around the ability to have a vision and really strongly, believe in that vision with enough conviction and like willingness to work hard and like to, to learn and to see what works and what doesn't.

But especially early on when we're talking about that, that state that you're in where, maybe the industry doesn't necessarily validate you completely or your friends and family don't, entirely understand or support you. I'm curious how you and what you'd recommend for everyone that's listening to this right now.

How do you maintain the right mindset? Like, how do you allow yourself to attach to that vision, that future self in a way that pulls you into it, despite, the internal self doubt that always happens and the external self doubt. How do you, like, how do resolve your mindset around that?

Erica Mason: Man, you think that even with the success that I have today those things don't happen anymore, but they do. The negative thinking, the self doubt, it's just a different lane now, right? But what I have learned to do is exercise gratitude. Sometimes we are so busy trying to reach the goal that we overlook the small wins that happen in our lives, right?

So for example, for me I used to focus on, when the song dropped, okay, I'm going to look at how many streams I'm getting every single day, like and counting it to the number, right? And if it didn't necessarily hit. The number that I was hoping for, and then now I'm discouraged, but I failed to realize this is actually the best performing song that you've done so far, you know what I'm saying?

Or another small win was when I would get, I didn't have a lot of streams on the song, but I had so many stories of people telling me how much the song had impacted them. And so for me, I started to focus on that okay, your music is actually doing what you want it to do, which is to help people and to heal people.

That's the ultimate goal, right? And so being able to detach myself from the numerical performance and being able to attach myself to the experience that people are having with the music allowed me to like really tap into the journey, like I said, but yeah, gratitude for one. 

Number two is community. Getting myself around people who understand the struggle and also have had share similar experiences, right? Because. Having that community of people that you can say, man I'm just really discouraged. They understand what you're going through. And you can actually they'll build you up.

They can encourage you. You encourage them. And you remember oh, snap I'm not necessarily alone in this. Okay, it's not just me. But sometimes I used to internalize it I'm the only person that's experiencing these roadblocks, or I'm the only person that's going through this.

And so being able to have community gave me perspective. But then also Having people that believe in you when you don't believe in yourself is also a good thing. I didn't always have that, right? So it took a second to find that. But when I did, I really helped those people close because it was less about them believing in my career and more about them believing in who I was.

And because who I am is so heavily embedded into my music career. They really supported me in those moments where I had tried to quit music multiple times. And it's just one of those things where it keeps coming back. And so being able to focus on the small wins, the fact that I dropped a song, that's a win, right?

Like sometimes we overlook that. The fact that you went through the process to upload it to the distributor, like you went to the studio, you recorded, you put your art out into the world. That is not something that's small. You put a piece of you into the world. And sometimes we can take that stuff for granted.

And so for me, I try to focus on that and say man, I finished a project. Like I've never dropped an album. I dropped an album. This is great, versus focusing so much on the performative stuff. So yeah, those would be the two things for me that have been really helpful with mindset.

Oh, and then also just putting before me affirmations in manifestations and stuff. Also really helps because I like to speak the things that I want to see into my life and that disrupts sometimes like the mental, negative mental patterns that are happening. So if I'm having a thought like I'm going to fail, like I will actually speak, no, I'm going to be successful. Everything my hand touches prospers. And so that helps me to rewire my thinking so that I can release more positivity and also ultimately attracting positivity. 

Michael Walker: And that's so powerful. Thank you for sharing that. As you're just describing the, really the role of surrounding yourself with people that believe in you, even when you're having your own hard times and

I know for myself personally, some of the mentors in my life, like the thing that made our relationship so special is that they were able to see something inside of me that I didn't see in myself. Yeah. And it makes me feel a little emotional just thinking about it because I know how big of an impact that made on my life.

And I know from hearing you talk about, the role of having those people in your life to that. It is so valuable to have that. And guess what? Everyone is here right now. You can do that for each other, too. That's what we're here for, is to be able to support each other and, a rising tide lifts all boats.

 I also love the reminder that You know, there's, as much as I don't want to quote Miley Cyrus yeah, there's always going to be another mountain. I'm always going to want to make a move, it's so true that, that even after achieving any sort of success you realize that you have to embrace, you have to appreciate the present moment and what you have right now and be grateful for what you have or else there's always going to be something else. It's like a state of mind of wanting to be somewhere else. So I love hearing, you share how important it is to have gratitude and how you bring that into your life on a daily basis.

One super powerful practice that I started doing that I feel like is similar to what you're talking about with the affirmations is every night, this is great for my relationship with my wife too is we, at the end of the day, we'll reflect on the day and just share our top three wins or gratitudes from the day.

And a lot of times it's little things too, or, the things that are so important, like our family and our kids and things that, of course, I'm grateful for my kids. But when I, if I come back to that regularly, then it's something that grounds me in appreciation.

Erica Mason: Yeah. 

Michael Walker: And then this was a new thing that we started doing that started making a big impact is doing three future gratitudes. So basically after we do the three gratitudes, thinking about what are three things in the future that I'm grateful for? And trying to bring that same energy of gratitude, but to the things in the future that haven't necessarily happened yet.

And like you described the rewiring your brain and because it's natural to like fear just happens especially if you're on a big stage, you're doing big stuff like you are then, you know it's natural for fear to come up. 

Erica Mason: Yeah, 

Michael Walker: but reframing it and thinking about I'm grateful that the stage, on discord, our first modern musician podcast was awesome and Erica crushed it.

And everyone had a great time, like expressing that before it happens just changes your emotional state and it just feels like it makes it like, there's gravity to it. Like it, it pulls things into happening. 

Erica Mason: That's so good. That's so good. Because what I realized is as I'm growing, I'm meeting so many artists that like I looked up to, and I wanted to be in their shoes and now I'm sharing stages and so it's really interesting to see that we're all still trying to figure that out. We're all learning how to be content with where we are because the industry is such like a performative based system, right?

And so based upon how well people like you or how well, an album does, that kind of oftentimes causes you to be celebrated or not. And the higher that you go, the more pressure it is to have to perform and to put on. There's so many people that, like, when I look at them, I'm like, man you're doing amazing, knowing that they're looking at someone else because they're trying to reach another plateau or another mark. And so it's just it's really good to start practicing that now because there's always yeah, my 100 percent it's always going to be another thing and another thing. And so to me I 100 percent love that because practicing gratitude helps you to stay present in the moment because you look back and you realize, man.

I have done so much in this year, right? That I don't even think I've slowed down to actually just acknowledge and say, wow, like you've done a lot. And yeah, because I'm always like, all right, that's checked off onto the next. That's checked off. 

Michael Walker: Yeah. It is so funny. It seems like there's a, I don't know if paradox is the right word, but there's like a juxtaposition between high achievers and and a balance between future thinking and goal setting and, being driven to, to meet an outcome and also at the same time appreciating where you're at right now, there's it's almost like a, there's like a dissonance. Can you hear my keyboard right now?

Yeah. You play a dissonant... chord... Then it creates tension, like it creates a sense of it's, you want it to resolve. It creates like movement, if the whole song was just like, perfect. There's nothing ever needs to change, ever like Harry Potter, the whole book is just he's just happy.

There's no Voldemort or anything. It just it doesn't have the same movement or the progression or the tension so it's so interesting seeing how do you like balance those, you already balance the tension or even create good tension, like good tension through goal setting to be able to achieve those things.

So I want to, I love that line of thinking too, and I would love to hear your thoughts on that, but but I feel like we've covered a lot of really good ground around like mindset and, and dedication and purpose. So one thing that I would love to pick your brain on a little bit, because I think it would be really valuable for everyone here is around your strategy on social media and how you grew a following on Instagram and on TikTok.

Could you share a little bit about your journey in terms of starting out? And what was it really that helped you to cut through the noise and be able to actually attract the right people who resonate with your message and with your music? 

Erica Mason: Absolutely. So the first thing was like, I was committed.

Like I just decided I'm going to make a TikTok a day. And that was it. My whole thing was I just want to get consistent when it comes to posting because I'm not consistent. And so as I began to do a TikTok a day, the next thing that I said was like, okay, now that I'm getting into the rhythm of actually making them, post them and then see what people are saying.

Pay attention to the likes, pay attention to the shares, the comments more than anything else. Because people will tell you what they like and what they don't like on social media. It's very clear because they'll tell you about their engagement if they like it or not. And so at first, I put out hundreds of videos and they weren't doing numbers.

So the first thing I had to set my mindset to know is that. Out the gate. I'm not gonna go viral. Like I'm just doing this because I want to be consistent. And so I would write a song a day because I was doing this exercise where I was writing a song a day in posting what I wrote, write a song, post, write a song, post.

And so I was developing this repetition muscle, right? Because really content, being able to make good content, it just comes with repetition and understanding like how your audience is resonating with what we've been doing. And so I would write the song, and I would post. And then once I post, I would take a break from it, come back, look at the shares, the likes, and the comments, and I would pay attention to what people were saying, if they were like, man, this really touched me.

This was, it was this line, when you said this really stuck out to me. And so I started to notice the best type of content for me was the emotional space, right? It was provoking emotion, which was causing them to take an action, right?

That action was either them to like it, to view it longer, or to share it with someone, or to post a comment about the content that they were engaging with. So I knew that. Okay, based upon what people are saying, they like this emotional stuff. There are people who want to know more about my experience as it pertains to my mental health and stuff.

And so I would take the next day and it was cool because I was going on my own, like healing journey with my music. And I was just sharing what my like daily journal was essentially in posting about it. And so from a very technical side, though, I was taking the content, writing the song and posting a snippet.

It wasn't a whole song. It was like, I'm a rapper, so I would post like maybe four to eight bars. And that was it. So it was like 15 to 20 seconds, 30 seconds. And I would pay attention to what people were saying. The next day I would just do a different variation. So I would still, I would write something that was emotional.

I would write something that may have sparked. Someone in the comments to start talking about something that they were going through. I will write something to that specifically, and then I will post it again, right? And so that's how it started. And from there, the more you do it, the more you improve your posts.

Then the more you know, I'm saying the better you get in the better you get the more engagement you get because you're actually giving people what they want to see. And so the key thing here that I'm studying is let me learn what you guys are saying that you want to see and let me actually give it to you.

And so yeah, I try to post at least five times a week. And out of those posts every time I post, I'm still paying attention. So what people are saying, and I'm still learning them because, the algorithm changes, people change, there's different needs and desires that people want and things like that.

And another thing is just the, I'll bring up is the TikTok, like in Instagram there. They're all the same essentially, but there's just different variations of it, but just understanding like the rules of the platform and kind of what works on these platforms and what doesn't. So I knew that with TikTok, it's more of a laid back, like it's not super serious.

Oftentimes the stuff that you really didn't try on, that's the stuff that's going viral on that, versus Instagram is more polished. It's a little bit more scripted. And because I knew that, I used TikTok as my playground to just try a bunch of stuff. And then what would do well on TikTok, I would post that on Instagram, right?

And so that kind of told me what would do well, but also the image of how it looked, right? So I didn't want to post a lot of polished stuff on TikTok because every time I post polished stuff on TikTok, it just did not do well. I understood that It was less about how good it looks and more about the information that was inside of the content or, the value of the content that was actually being posted.

So in my case, what I was saying in my lyrics was the most important. And so I would just take the camera and put it in, just show the side of my face and then have the words just going down because I knew that people were saying they resonated with my lyrics the most. So let me just have them be able to see the lyrics while I'm just sitting here in this state and I'm rapping, but I'm not looking at the camera. And that was another thing I noticed too. Like I would get way more interaction when I wasn't looking at the camera versus when I was. And I realized that was because a lot of the things that I'm saying is so emotional.

That like it's very I don't know, invasive to say something so strong. And then you're also looking at me versus turning to the side and things. So that's just a small thing that I learned, but yeah. Does that answer your question? I feel like I'm rambling. 

Michael Walker: So totally answers it. Yeah.

Super smart. So it sounds like, in a nutshell, you committed to every single day you're writing an original, new piece of music and a new song, but specifically, breaking it down into a 15 to 30 second clip of a new song and you would create a post a day around the music and through the process of that daily rhythm and seeing how people responded to it. Holy cow. That's that's a lot. 

I think that one thing. That is easy to overlook sometimes just the power of daily routines and daily rhythms. And for me, the morning routine is a great example of this, but if I get a really dialed in morning routine, I'm doing every single morning, then that has like a huge cumulative effect because after a while I don't have to think about or do consciously, the gravity pulls you towards doing it more so then, it doesn't take as much energy or effort towards doing it because you already have the ball rolling. So it makes a lot of sense that, you figure out some sort of daily habit or daily routine.

And I love the fact that not only did you create, but you actually put this on yourself to post it, and put it out, and release it, and get the feedback from it. Yes. It's also interesting, just the, when we were in LA, we talked a lot about the moments and music relics and breaking down, the songs from three minutes or five minutes or whatever.

It's for better or for worse, it definitely seems like our, attention has gotten to more bite sized pieces of content. And it seems like you're ahead of the curve as it relates to getting really good at creating that bite sized, 15 to 30 second, pieces of amazing content. Yeah. Let me check in with you guys right now to make sure that you can still see and hear us. If you're with us in the audience, leave us a comment. If you're getting value from this so far, say YEAH! In the chat. Hey Ari, I see Robin Hood says not having a family made me stronger and made me learn to seek fans and input and take feedback and constructive criticism as well to grow.

Wow. Sorry. Sorry to hear that. You said not having your family. I don't know if you meant support you or what happened, but lots of people saying thank you. Lansingia says, I feel this. Yes. Yeah. 

Oh, Tre' Rochelle as well. Yeah, you probably remember Tre' from LA.

She's amazing. I'm talking about, people who have soul. That's like a part of her brand is like bringing the soul. But yeah, this is great. Maybe we could talk a little bit about having done this for so long and, gotten into a habit of seeing what resonates with people and what doesn't.

Obviously your community and the type of people that you connect with or that are attracted to your music are going to be different than, different communities that are attracted to different people. So there's going to be different types of content or different lessons and whatnot, but also at the same time, there are going to be foundational things that are always true regardless of what kind of music you make or what type of message you have. So I'm curious if you have any recommendations for anyone that's listening to this right now who maybe they're listening to this and they're saying, Oh my gosh, Erica's amazing.

She so inspired me. Like I'm going to commit for at least 30 days to, record song a day so that I can post and I'm just going to record the 15 to 32nd, version of the song and post it and release it. I'm curious if you have any other pieces of advice in regards to things that you think would, regardless of what genre someone's making, like what are some of those things that really helped it cut through the noise and connect and provide value?

Yeah, content? Yeah. 

Erica Mason: Yeah. So regardless of what industry you're in, this is just content advice in general, emotional content, stuff that sparks emotions. And what I mean by that is makes you laugh. It makes you feel good. It makes you sometimes cry. Those are the ones that you're going to see oftentimes on your explore page or your for you page.

These are the ones that people are resonating with the most, depending on what platform you're on. For example, TikTok. It's really catered to you, right? So there's emotional content there's educational content, and then there's inspiration I tie that to emotional as well, but educational content is, you teaching someone something or you're giving your lens on a certain situation that gives a solution to someone else, right?

And those are the things that whatever genre you're in, if you can think about what space you're in, who your person is, your avatar, or your listener. And you think about what makes them laugh? What makes them feel discomfort? What kind of problems are they actually facing right now in their lives?

Or just why are they listening to my music? Like, how does my music like speak to them? And then you take that and you put it in bite sizes. So if you are a person who you're in rock, but maybe you are like soft rock and maybe you're, I don't know. Let me think of something that's not anywhere near what I do.

Like you have, it's all about like memes or something and you just do songs about whatever's trending right now. The cool part about that is you can use humor as a way to connect with people. A lot of people use social media to escape their everyday life and they go there to find humor. They go there to find connection.

That's something that has nothing to do with whatever it is that they want to distract themselves from and oftentimes humor is a way that you can do that. And so thinking from a music standpoint, what kind of Humorous lines or funny lines. Can I put into the music that's 15 to 30 seconds.

And this is the clip. Like, how can I say the funniest thing or whatever? And let me just post that. And then from there, like you're going to look at, what the audience is saying, what the comments are saying. And then you are making it better for me. Does that make sense? So I'm trying to say you're trying to use a scenario, but like emotions.

Are going to be number one, like there are more emotions than just feeling sad and feeling happy, right? But your music is a universal language that speaks to a person's soul, which I look at that as like your mind, your emotions. And so how can your music highlight that to get them to do a specific action?

Or maybe your music is educational. I see some singers who are actually using the education or edutainment is what they call it space where they're using their music to educate people online. There's this one person who's like teaching you how to learn Spanish, but they're doing it through music. And then they're going viral and people are finding the songs on Spotify, right?

But they're doing it from an education space because people are actually learning Spanish, but through the songs that they're writing and creating. And so it's just thinking about how can you educate your fans? How can you create value? That's the biggest thing is like value. Anything that sparks the emotions is going to be valuable.

Whether that's funny emotions, it might make you feel sad, it might make you feel like, man, I'm glad I saw this content today because it's really made me feel better. Depending on what niche you're in, the emotions that you're using the comments of people's emotions, it's going to move and then also educating people, help them to solve their problems in their life or something that they want to be solved in their life. It doesn't necessarily have to be a problem, but maybe they just didn't know. Maybe these are random facts, and you love random facts, and you want to make songs about random facts. It's just teaching people about randomness. That, I've seen that done, and it's been done very well.

Michael Walker: So good. Yeah. So it sounds like what you're saying is that , one common point of focus is around creating content that triggers emotions and what is music, but a vehicle to transmit emotions. And so what you're talking about and sharing your story to o one thing that comes across is you described how you, there's a feeling of vulnerability or, yeah, I think a lot of people can relate with this.

Something's happened to them or they have some emotional, trauma or things that they've gone through and, maybe those are the pieces of ourselves that we're most afraid to share because we're afraid of being exposed or being seen or being hurt. And so we might have, we might try to avoid those things when, according to what you're saying, it's like, those are actually the things that resonate with people and the things that really are going to help you, make an impact and move people.

Erica Mason: Yeah. And even if it's not necessarily the sad stuff, the funny stuff, the light, like the family stuff, right? There's some people who I know they don't want to show their family and I understand. But they also have of audience full of moms. So it's very like, in my mind, I'm like, that's gonna help you to relate to them a lot more because they can see that you also have children and they now look at you like, whoa, this is another level of connection I didn't even know we had.

Michael Walker: Yeah. Awesome. Yeah. There's one song I wrote recently called Hello Willow that I wrote for my daughter Willow. And I feel like I'm never going to be able to play that song live because every time I start playing, I get emotional, I start crying, but maybe that's actually the, maybe that's the thing that I should be sharing.

But how would you recommend? Because one thing with who you are and with your journey and with your music and everything that you're sharing, you have so much of it's about healing, healing from trauma and obviously, emotions and what we share within our music can be hugely therapeutic and in a way to heal from trauma.

So I'm curious for anyone who's here right now, who's inspired enough to say, you know what, I'm going to take 30 days and I'm going to do what Erica suggested. I'm going to record, something once per day and post it. And maybe, yeah, who here right now is willing to raise their hand and actually make, commit to doing that for 30 days?

This is an unplanned thing, but I'm curious, who here is actually is yeah, I'm down to, for 30 days straight. Once a day, I'm going to make, 15 or 30 second clip of a new song and share it. I see a lot of people who are requesting to speak raising their hands. So I assume that's like a, yep, I'm in.

For someone who is, interested in kind of embarking on that journey, and they're starting to brainstorm and think about, what do I want to release, and, what kinds of songs do I want to write, what kind of music do you have any recommendations for how It's like a radar for, for looking at internally and looking around at your own emotions and and topics or ideas for songs and then choosing saying, Oh, that's what I really should share.

That's what I need to share and creating a post around that. 

Erica Mason: Yeah. If I think I understand what you're asking me, but I would say like knowing yourself, especially for me in my space, because I deal with a lot of emotions, mental health, wellness and things so there's some things that I might write about that I'm not ready to share yet.

And so knowing yourself enough to know what you're ready to share and what you're not ready to share, because the moment you share, you're opening yourself up, of course, for criticism, things like that. And if it's something that you're not necessarily ready to share, don't share it. But still having that exercise of writing to get it out.

That's cool. Like I have so many songs that I will probably never release because I'm cussing everybody out and it's just terrible. But then there's the other side of it where you just feel within yourself one man, this song really speaks to me a lot, and then the next thing that I do is I test it in the market, right?

Because I've had songs where I was like, Oh, this is hot. This is great. And everybody else is it's cool. You know what I mean? So it's like the first part Is making sure it resonates with you like you approve of this. It's like this is something that i'm proud of but then two putting it out there and the samples will tell you like as you're creating these 15 second clips these little lines or whatever people will tell you like yeah, please finish this like it doesn't have to be a finished song I've never finished the songs like until I got to a point where they were forcing me because they wanted the music.

They were like, please, can you drop this song? But yeah, so it was like putting it in front of people and just letting them have their own experience with it. And when they got oftentimes the same kind of feeling that I felt about this. Then I knew I was like, Oh, this one, I believe this one is going to do well because it already resonates with me.

But now I'm seeing that it's resonating with other people which converts ultimately to the analytics, the numbers and stuff like that. 

Michael Walker: Man, one thing I love about having conversations like this, Erica, is because I feel like there's a network effect or there's a you have great ideas or when you're like bouncing ideas off of people.

When we were in LA, for example, like all the ideas are like bouncing off of each other. One idea that I just had as you're talking, there was around. Moments with music relics, what if, for 30 days or for a year, what if every single one of those moments that you had created was actually turned into something that the fan could own?

Erica Mason: That would be amazing. 

Michael Walker: You could use that as like a testing ground to see these are the moments that people really value and they're the ones that that people resonated with. Therefore, I'm going to take this moment and I'm actually going to turn this into a song. And then it's almost like a reversal of, instead of starting with, the song, like you start with the moments, which are, you can test out different hooks, different ideas, see which ones resonate with people.

And then and then turn that into a, a full song or full album. 

Erica Mason: That's exactly what you said. That's exactly what it is. And then you can even get to a place where, it's a way to potentially crowd fund with the moments as well. If people who really like this song, if there's three moments or four moments that you are doing at one time, people can vote by basically, they want to add money to it or whatever.

And that helps them to be able to get the song done. You don't have to do it on your own budget. Like your fans can help, bring that song together. And so I've seen that work as well. Like when they want something, they'll make it happen. 

Michael Walker: Cool. Man, I just got goosebumps as you're talking about that, that's a really cool idea.

So how about we go ahead and bring some folks who are here live onto the podcast and we have any volunteers for who wants to be the very first speaker of all time, gotta be like the best question ever. No pressure at all. No pressure. Everyone. is going to be judging you. We have a very loving community here, so no pressure either way, but if you'd like to come on here live, if you want to raise your hand and request to speak, then we can actually bring you on here live, and you can ask a question, and yeah, let's go ahead and let's do it.

I see lots of folks raising their hands. Let's start with Jim Byron. Oops. Did I click it? Did I do it? Okay, I think I invited you to speak. Can you see? 

Jim: Hey man. 

Michael Walker: Hey, how you doing? 

Jim: Great. Awesome. Pleasure to meet you guys. I believe I've seen one of your videos that went viral. You are an amazing artist. So true to your craft. It's an honor and a pleasure. Quick question, guys. How do you work through the low points because I was actually thinking about doing a 30 day producer challenge, to hold myself accountable, as well as have the community hold me accountable for improving my production skills.

I'm a songwriter, I'm a rapper from Staten Island News New York City, so and I want to get more into production. But something that'll get you through those low points of I really don't feel like doing it today. Great question. to answer or do you want me to answer? I would say you can give it a crack first and I'll, I'm happy to contribute if there's anything left unsaid, but I have a feeling that you have a pretty good answer to this one.

Erica Mason: Just do it. You do it anyway. When you make that 30 day commitment, set your mindset and intention to know that there are going to be days where I don't feel like doing this, but I'm going to do it anyway. And oftentimes when I have had these challenges, so like for the recording and also shooting a day, like once a day, I was doing that in the morning where my energy was the highest.

For me, that was really good because I prioritize it in the 1st of my day because I knew if I didn't prioritize it, then it's not even right. And so set yourself up to win by prioritizing at the best time that you're able to get stuff done. And then do it anyway, discouraged, do it anyway, annoyed, do it anyway, hungry, do it anyway just commit.

It's only 30 days, and that's what I would tell myself. It's only 30 days, and then it turn into another 30 days, and another. But, it's only 30 days. 

Michael Walker: Yup, super smart. 

Jim: Thank you so much. 

Michael Walker: Yeah, I can piggyback on that a little bit. There's something magical that happens when you set a time scope and you say, look, this isn't going to be forever.

I'm just going to do it for seven days or 30 days. I'm going to do it once a day for X amount of time where it's it gives your brain permission to be like, okay, it's uncomfortable, but I'm going to, I'm going to do it until X, Y, Z. So I think that's super smart. The the other thing that comes to mind is around, there's a book I read called Willpower Doesn't Work, and the idea of the book was that, you want to set up your environment so that the thing that you want to have happen just happens automatically or happens on its own, regardless of your willpower.

One example of this, I've also heard this called inevitability thinking. It's like, how can you make success inevitable? And... One, you don't have to go this extreme, but one way I've heard to describe make an inevitable is, for example, if you want to start getting in the habit of going for a run every morning for half an hour, then one way you could make it inevitable.

You can set up your circumstances is you could get an accountability buddy or kind of an accountability partner like a friend and send them a check for 2,000 and say, if I don't, you send you a message at X o'clock timestamp. That it's legit and I'm not like super sweaty getting back from my run that I want you to instantly cash this check, no matter what, then, now the environment is like, it's going to be more uncomfortable to not get up and go for a run. You might wake up and be like, Oh, I'm sore. I didn't sleep great last night or what, but it's, it'll be more uncomfortable to pay 2,000 versus just getting up and doing it.

So that's an extreme way to to think about it. But in general, just like setting up your environment. So like when you wake up in the morning, like Erica suggested, like one of the first things you do is to do this challenge. And it just happens I think John Mayer said that the reason, one of his tricks to getting really good at guitar was that he put his guitar out of his, outside of his bathroom. And every time he went to the bathroom, he would see the guitar and he would play on it. So just like putting things in your environment so that the thing you want to happen just happens.

Great piece of advice. Cool. Thanks for the question. That was a really good one. 

Jim: Love that you guys. Thank you. 

Michael Walker: You nailed it. That was a great first question. Despite the massive pressure that I'm sure... There was a lot of pressure there. But you did well. You did well. You did great. 

All right. I see J. Ruby Wiley is here. Can you see and hear us? Okay.

J Ruby Wiley: Yeah. Can y'all hear me? 

Michael Walker: Yeah, we've got you. Woo. 

J Ruby Wiley: Nice to meet y'all. So my biggest question is what are some of the ways that you managed to overcome some of the hardest times or maybe just some tips to help like other artists like get through those moments if you have like three to five tips that really help can be big or small.

Erica Mason: Yeah. So one of the things that I did when I would add community again, like that's probably gonna always be one for me surrounding myself with mentors. As well as surrounding myself with other artists who are going through what I'm going, who are at like the same kind of level that I'm at. And actually connecting with them, having conversations with them, supporting them, and like them supporting you as well.

It's really good to have support when you're all trying to figure it out because the biggest thing that I think sometimes we feel is like we're alone or like we question man, what's wrong with me? Why is it not working with me? And really there's nothing wrong with you. It's just a part of the process.

It's a part of the journey you're growing and you're learning and being able to be around other people who are also growing and learning is helpful. The other thing that I would say again is focusing on setting smart goals. I like those because we have these big grandiose goals, right? But sometimes if we can cut them up into chunk sizes so that we can make our celebrations, like the smaller celebrations, we can celebrate, right?

So we know we want to do a roll to a million followers or a roll to a million streams or whatever. Maybe the first goal is like my first 100, right? And that's going to be something that I'm going to celebrate. Obviously, the major goal is in the back of your mind, but that first 100 is a huge milestone too.

And so having those milestones where you can celebrate yourself. I think it's really important because it takes that negative energy off of you when you're feeling like, I don't know, I guess a little lower discouraged about what's not happening. Then another thing is unfollow. The unfollow button is a really great tool.

And the reason why I say this is because sometimes when we're in the process of trying to figure out ourselves and find our sound and our theme, what we tend to do is we tend to follow everybody else and we tend to look at what everybody else is doing and unintentionally we compare ourselves because we , look at what someone else has going on, and then subconsciously, we're looking at what we don't have going on.

Versus, you should be looking at, actually, you do have some things going on here, and so what I had to do in that space to, and I still do it now, is unfollow people who make me feel a little like I'm comparing myself to them, and it's an unhealthy comparison, right? And especially when I'm in the building stages oftentimes, I mute everybody.

Even if they, even if I'm not necessarily opposed to your stuff, like I just mute them because I don't want anything to get in the way to make my judgment.

Michael Walker: Golden. Awesome. So I think he might be muted right now, but he's nodding and agreeing, I think I was super valuable. 

J Ruby Wiley: Yeah, that was great. Thank you so much. And nice to meet you. 

Erica Mason: Nice to meet you. Thank you. 

Michael Walker: Awesome. Hey, Erica, I think I think we've gone over our hour here. So we'll wrap it up.

I know time flies when you're having fun. Erica, thank you again so much for you know comin' on here and be in our first ever interview on the live podcast. I have a feeling that this is going to be a really core part of, what we do with our community now is the weekly live podcast recording that we can put onto the modern musician podcast.

So I couldn't have asked for a better one to start with and. One final question to leave people with, if you could go back to yourself at the very beginning when you're just starting out and maybe in like your darkest points or like one of your most challenging points and you could share one piece of advice for yourself.

What would you share? 

Erica Mason: Be grateful. Be grateful. You can't see it now. But you're going to look back on these slow moments, and you're going to wish that you could slow down and just be present, because where I'm at right now, it's so much that's happening. And it's just, it's a new, it's a new devil, new level, new devil, whatever that saying is.

It's just a new weight, right? And so I would definitely tell myself, be grateful for where you are, and look around, be present you are doing a great job don't get so focused on what you don't have, that you miss out on what you do have. Because as you grow, it only gets bigger. And if you can't see what the value and what you have right now, it's not like you're going to see it when you actually get there, because by the time you get there, your eyes are going to be set on something else.

And so just be grateful for where you are.

Michael Walker: Beautiful. Hey, let's give a virtual round of applause to Erica. Thank you so much. This is awesome. And thank you so much for being a part of our first ever live podcast recording. Looking forward to doing this once a week starting from here on out. We're going to be doing this on Fridays at 4.30. Yeah, let's go ahead and let's wrap it up. 

Hey it’s Michael here. I hope that you got a ton of value out of this episode. Make sure and check out the show notes to learn more about our guest today.

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